Interlogix Vs Hikvision Tested

Sad.

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Undisclosed

Did you review your results with Interlogix? Are you telling us that after they figured out you were finding outstanding security issues they didn't suddenly find an update to share?

UTC claims they care about cyber, don't they?

So much for rumors it's the same "airframe" with "better" firmware.

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John Honovich

IPVM

In reply to Undisclosed

We have tried to talk to UTC / Interlogix in the past but now have given up. They are incapable of even responding to simple questions, there is zero chance they are going to respond to this.

And what can they say? Once we verified that they were still impacted by the old cracked Hikvision security codes, it was certain that they were not only using Hikvision firmware but old ones at that.

We're happy to talk to UTC / Interlogix in the future, if they are willing to speak directly and honestly about what they are doing. I do not plan to reach out to them for now, they know who we are and how to get a hold of us. If they want, they can contact us and happy to talk to them.

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Undisclosed Integrator #4

•Sep 12, 2017

In reply to Undisclosed

I have spoken to UTC about the issues with cyber security on these Hik devices they re-brand. They acknowledge that the issues are there when presented with the evidence but will not make any changes necessary giving a variety of "reasons" that the changes cannot be made. It is truly sad that they take such a cavalier attitude towards this and put integrators and their customer at such a risk.

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Abdelhamid Metwally

IPVMU Certified

Is the pricing different for Hikvision/Dahua in the US market?

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Ethan Ace

In reply to Abdelhamid Metwally

Interlogix pricing is generally moderately higher than Hikvision's, based on our review of distribution pricing. However, the actual pricing differential will certainly be heavily impacted by the level of dealer a company is and the current situation of discounts / promos (which both companies do fairly regularly).

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Undisclosed Manufacturer #2

•Sep 09, 2017

Quite simple really... UTC product is just a Hik OEM.

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Undisclosed Manufacturer #3

In reply to Undisclosed Manufacturer #2

Absolutely, they were doing OEM with Hik over 15yrs ago, long before Hik were known under their own name..

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John Honovich

In reply to Undisclosed Manufacturer #3

IPVM

Absolutely, they were doing OEM with Hik over 15yrs ago

Hikvision was 1 years old 15 years ago (i.e., 2002). Are you sure about that date? Hikvision at its origin, to my knowledge, was selling capture cards (i.e., components) but not full systems.

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Undisclosed Manufacturer #3

It was definitely around 2004/5 and it was one of the first real time 16ch 30fps analogue DVR's to market, but the GUI totally sucked. It took a year at least to get the GUI up to a marketable level.

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Jon Dillabaugh

Pro Focus LLC

Have you checked their GSA status? Has Interlogix been spec'd for public projects? Dig deeper...

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Michael Votaw

Newest firmware forces a password to be set with complex requirement. Interlogix also dictates how the camera is built and uses a very customized version of firmware that goes through in house testing and vetting for security. It may be built by Hikvision, but it's not a Hikvision camera by any means.

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Undisclosed

In reply to Michael Votaw

that is completely inconsistent with what they told me.

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John Honovich

In reply to Michael Votaw

IPVM

Michael, thanks for the feedback.

What is the version # you are referring to that forces a password?

Also, what do you mean by "It may be built by Hikvision, but it's not a Hikvision camera by any means"? For example, what things that we reported do you believe are factually false? Or what other elements have we not discussed that would apply here? Thanks!

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Undisclosed Integrator #5

Let's run that little back door test thingy against one of those "definitely not a Hikvision" camera.

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Rob Kilpatrick

IPVM • IPVMU Certified

Update:

During our initial testing the Interlogix NVR was vulnerable to being reset via the Hikvision reset tool. Interlogix has since released firmware fixing this and changing their password reset method. Our earlier reporting also stated that Interlogix used default credentials, this since has been changed and a user must create a unique password at first login. A section was added at the bottom of the report to reflect these changes.

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Undisclosed Integrator #4

I had given Interlogix a list of about 14 security items that needed fixes on their Hik rebranded products over 3 years ago. Now they are getting to them, well at least halfway getting to them. Well done UTC Interlogix!

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Undisclosed Integrator #6

I had a great conversation with a Interlogix sales engineer yesterday. Starting with their Truvision 7.1 software there is a one time optional fee for a client that when you connect that client to a system it will automatically push firmware updates to all devices on the network.
The only exceptions to this are the cameras directly attached to their "S" model DVRs because the cameras are in a different subnet with NAT in between.

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

In reply to Undisclosed Integrator #6

Not all devices on the network, only devices on the local network. See the same issue with device manager. Won't cross subnets even though Nav knows where the NVR's are.

Works fantastic, but found that NVR's/Cameras on different subnets, although they can be seen in Navigator and across the network, will not scan for firmware. I believe that's correct with the right terms.

Have to know the limitations of the system. I believe they can address that as you could force the old device manager to scan a subnet manually and it would find every device on it.

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Undisclosed Manufacturer #7

Presumably the best selling camera across the board. Does anyone know if it works with interlogic simon panel？

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Undisclosed

I tried to follow up with Interlogix on this and got terrible feedback. Their switches are insecure swill. I don't see a reason to trust them to sell you a secure camera. (And if they want to wake up and start talking to us here, feel free. Kinda tired of the talk-to-the-hand attitude.)

"It sells therefore it is good" is a crack dealer's metric, not a trusted security vendor metric.

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

In reply to Undisclosed

I'd agree that they are not good at communication, but they are doing some really good work. They have a security team that tests all their products, they address security issues and they are truly concerned that they sell a quality product. It's not rebranded, it's their product manufactured by a third parts.

Full disclosure, I'm not a network security expect.

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John Honovich

IPVM

It's not rebranded, it's their product manufactured by a third parts.

It's clearly Hikvision's firmware / software on the cameras with, from everything we see, trivial changes. If that is not rebranded, what is?

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

They drive the specifications of the hardware and firmware. That's not a re-brand, that's third party manufacturing. Sure, there are very definite similarities, as there are with a lot of electronics these days. I couldn't tell you exactly what they mandate in manufacturing, but I know it's decent product, they take engineering and security seriously and they stand behind it.

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John Honovich

IPVM

#8, did you even read our test report? They have the same UI and information structure down to low-level details; they are identified as the same type of camera, they use the same password reset, etc. Clearly, Interlogix is taking stock Hikvision IP camera firmware with only the minor modifications.

Copying this comparison below to highlight this:

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

Even minor modifications can have significant benefit. We're splitting hairs. There is no question who makes it, but they don't just slap a logo on the side of a Hik product and call it their own.

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John Honovich

IPVM

Even minor modifications can have significant benefit.

Which ones? On the IP cameras, the only differences we have seen are cosmetic. If you or Interlogix can find or share others, please let us know.

If buying Hikvision IP cameras with the Interlogix name makes you feel better, so be it but I think we should be accurate about what the technology is.

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

I couldn't say, as I can't speak for them and only know what I've been told by the rep. Maybe they will jump in at some point and we'll all know more.

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John Honovich

IPVM

From my interaction with Interlogix / UTC reps, they are in the dark, just parroting what management tells them.

But I recommend you do what we did, get a Hikvision IP camera and an Interlogix IP camera, open up their web interfaces side by side and go through it. I think if you do that you will see that it is virtually the same thing with minor cosmetic differences.

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Undisclosed Integrator #5

Would you say the BOSCH Divar is OEM or 3rd party contract manufacturer?

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

In reply to Undisclosed Integrator #5

Couldn't say. Don't know that line. If they stick a Bosch label on someone's box, it's a re-brand. If they put real engineering into the specification, design and operation to make it theirs, I'd say it's a 3rd party contract manufacturer with a known base unit.

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John Honovich

In reply to Undisclosed Integrator #5

IPVM

See - Bosch Divar NVR Tested vs Dahua

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Ethan Ace

•Feb 19, 2019

We received some feedback on this report:

I appreciate the article's attempt to compare two similar products, but I find the author's knowledge of the Interlogix line to be so limited as to cause unfair bias. I realize the article is dated (Sep 2017), but it is the first to come up from a google search of comparison between the two brands. There are inaccuracies regarding cloud access and the software, and what sounds like bias and/or ignorance regarding the firmware. There are also omissions regarding bandwidth usage and compatibility, and an odd comparison of the two recorders (a 4 channel visually compared to an 8? They both had 8 channel at the time, easily accessible). In the end, it sounds like someone who is ignorant about one (both?) products and their functions, and just wanted to rush the story to publish. A LOT has changed with the Interlogix line, I'm sure the same can be said about Hikvision. Perhaps an update is in order?

I updated firmware to recheck some of the findings which were questioned, and this was my response:

We are open to corrections if there are factual mistakes in the report. At them time, Interlogix did not object to any specific claims in our discussions, so perhaps things have changed since then? Can you clarify some of your comments?

Can you expand on what is inaccurate regarding cloud access? Specifically, has Interlogix added cloud access with no port forwarding required? The mentions I see of ezDDNS still mention manual port forwarding. I just updated to latest camera firmware and that still seems to be the case.

What firmware differences are there between Hikvision and Interlogix? We have asked Interlogix this question multiple times and gotten no clear answer. In our original test, and today using updated firmware, we saw few differences, and nothing that would lead us to believe it was anything other than slightly edited Hikvision.

Bandwidth was omitted at the time because it was functionally irrelevant given everything else in the test. If we do updated testing, we will include it.

Finally, you mention compatibility. Can you expand on what you mean there? VMS compatibility or something else?

Again, we are open to changes, but we haven't gotten practical feedback that anything was inaccurate.

If anyone has any comments or questions about specifics related to this test, please share. We absolutely want to correct any errors.

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Clint Hays

•Feb 19, 2019

In reply to Ethan Ace

Hey Ethan, did you guys test their NVR's for ONVIF G compliance by chance? I'd be curious to see if the latest firmware supports video retrieval through the G protocols.

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Michael Votaw

•Feb 25, 2019

Take note that series 6 just released with updated firmware and features. Interlogix is different, I know you want specifics, but they won't release them for various reasons. They specify the hardware, they write or heavily modify the firmware, they in house cyber security test the product. I can't give you anything more than I know they do it unfortunately. I've asked and best I can guess is that legal and security team keeps specifics in house or discusses with high level clients as needed for various reasons. They have issues like everyone, but it's been a darn good product for us. Series 6 is Onvif G.

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John Honovich

In reply to Michael Votaw

IPVM

Michael, thank you. We purchased 2 Interlogix Series 6 cameras and have just started testing. When we release the new report, we will update this one with whatever major differences or similarities exist.

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Abdelhamid Metwally

IPVMU Certified

Apparently their new cameras save a lot on bandwidth compared to their previous models. It would be good to actually test this out.

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Clint Hays

In reply to Abdelhamid Metwally

When I tested multiple devices the other week, all on the latest published FW, they did not have onvif G capability.

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Undisclosed Integrator #8

Which model did you buy?

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Ethan Ace

We bought two, a varifocal outdoor dome, TVD-5604, and a fixed lens turret, TVT-5601.

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Michael Votaw