If You Had To Pick A Single CCTV Brand To Sell And It Could Not Be Chinese, What Would It Be?

I like to have these random sorts of thought experiments sometimes. I was thinking about Axis, but Panasonic is an interesting thought too since their product line is quite extensive and includes several flavors of recording devices as well. What would you choose?


Scott, that is an interesting thought question. To clarify, I presume you mean cameras here?

Related, all 5 of the IPVM integrator favorite cameras were not Chinese (though, of course, all of them are far more expensive than the Chinese).

Not just cameras, the entire product line. Whatever you choose has to be able to give you cameras and recording. Of course you also have to think about flexibility. Can you handle both a mom and pop gas station and a large complicated hospital with the same system and somehow still meet the budgets of both?

Mobotix. Cameras and management software. All non chinese

All non chinese

Define all, non

All of mobotix cams and software are german and non chinese

Interesting choice, I have used a lot of Mobotix stuff and I am not sure I would fully commit to them if it were my only choice. Although they do have the complete package including access control.

Toshiba

Since I have never personally used any of their products, why is this your choice?

Try TBT (www.tbtcctv.com) from Korea everything from analog cameras to thermal FHD cameras

LOL, I am gonna call BS on that one since we all know they are Chinese.

I'm always the last to know anything around here...

2, give them credit, at least on their Facebook page which you linked to they acknowledge the Hikvision connection:

EZVIZ Inc. is a subsidiary of Hikvision USA Inc., leading North American video surveillance supplier, and operates its business from California.

Related: Ezviz = Hikvision = Chinese Government

You may be confusing Hangzou Hikvision, a Chinese company with Hikvision USA, a global operator with corporate offices in over a dozen countries, not even one of them named China. From their LinkedIn page:

About Hikvision USA and Hikvision Canada
Hikvision is the world’s leading supplier of video surveillance solutions.... Renowned across the globe, Hikvision systems are currently installed in more than 100 countries on six continents... Hikvision has global operations with regional offices in the United States, Canada, the Netherlands, Italy, United Kingdom, Russia, Singapore, South Korea, Australia, Brazil, South Africa and Dubai...

You don't think they would mention South Africa and not mention China do you? ;)

No my friend none of us are confused its HikVision for sure

Not clear if you mean end to end or just cameras but it is Avigilon for us.

Yes end to end

I would second that as well. Avigilon would be an easy, wise choice.

Avigilon here as well.

Verint. That said, our focus is enterprise level deployments so end-to-end for us could be Verint. If our focus was smaller market, then it likely would not be a choice.

For flexibility, they have recorders, servers, storage, workstations, cameras, VMS, Situational Awareness (SMC) and phone line recording not to mention a solid showing in video off-loading for mobile applications such as driver-less trains, buses, etc where wifi network saturation is not guaranteed.

Should also say can not include any OEM products from Chinese manufacturers

From my recent experience I would say Avigilon. It is a little high on price however when you plug it in it just simply works!! I have had very few issues with that product. Their online training portal is also great. That is the only training the any of my technical people at my last company have needed to complete.

It would be great to see Avigilon release some lower cost products to target the mid to lower end market with. With their current edge recorders they are going down that track however the pricing is still very high in comparison to other brands because it is a OEM version of the razberi server. http://www.razberi.net/

Should also say can not include any OEM products from Chinese manufacturers

That really limits the field... I mean, I'd say 3xLogic, as we've been using their DVRs for over a decade (currently made in Colorado, originally made in Victoria, BC), and they've been selling re-badged Hikvision cameras for almost as long. So I guess that eliminates an all-North-American VMS because they OEM Chinese cameras.

But then if you really wanna get down to it, how many NVRs use Chinese-made PC motherboards?

First of some, a little of meaning of "not be chinese"

Some Non chinese companies has products from OEM Chinese Manufactures, and this do not turn into chineses companies. (because for eg. quality is being handled by the first one)

More over, there exist non chinese companies, which manufactures some cam models at china, and this do not turn into chineses companies.(because design and quality is being develop by the first one)

Just in case, you are looking for a Camera Manufacturer, whose HQ are not in China....

if you are looking for Brand which is valuated for its "reliability, quality and technology" dont heasitate to use Axis Communications.

why Axis, the creator of the IP Camera will remain for so long as #1 at Global Market Shared on IP Cameras?

The answer is because of its continuous innovations with highly degree of acceptance by customer.

why Axis, the creator of the IP Camera will remain for so long as #1 at Global Market Shared on IP Cameras?

Axis has not been #1 in IP camera market share for 2 years or so. Hikvision is.

Axis does continue to innovate somewhat but not enough to offset Hikvision selling similar cameras for most applications at 30-50% less price with the same support levels.

John,

Agree with the price argue, but cause the discussion were to say non chinese, I do not take into consideration Hikvision, Dahua and Any other chinese manufacturer.

Rg

I am going to throw my response in here,

I have been a Bosch dealer for a very very long time , and have installed some enterprise level surveillance systems using a total Bosch solution. Quality is good,supply chain and rma system is good as well.

I typically purchase Bosch through Tri-Ed or ADI, as I can get as good or better pricing than as a direct dealer and if I have an RMA can work locally rather than New York time.

I'm afraid that if you were to take the Bosch cameras apart, you'll most likely find that they have "made in China" labels inside.

I'm afraid that if you were to take the Bosch cameras apart, you'll most likely find that they have "made in China" labels inside.

Just hold on now, Mister u9! With a reputable company like Bosch I sincerely doubt you're going find that type of thing.

I'm sure they peel them off long before they're out the door.

Hmm, they must have missed the labels on the cameras that I've seen recently.

Every separate component had the same "made in China" label

Every separate component had the same "made in China" label

The whole is greater than the sum of its parts. ;)

Love it.

I think you will find that with nearly all of the manufacturers discussed here. Pelco just released a "low cost" line. GE's Truvision line reeks of Hikvision engineering right down to HD-TVI.

Flir

Flir FLIR, Lorex, Digimerge or DvTel?

Geutebruck. Solid German engineering. Good camera line. VMS and storage.

Geutebruck. Solid German engineering. Good camera line. VMS and storage.

If I had one brand to own I this (or Dallmeier) would come to mind.

I'm not sure I would want to sell it as my only brand.

2, can you elaborate? I am not sure what you mean. Perhaps you trying to write that in German? :)

Ya vol' herr kommandant!

What I meant was that Dallmeier and Geuterbruck are top of the line brands, which is great; the product is outstanding, the margins are excellent, the channel well protected.

A good line to carry, if you deal with clientele that can afford it.

But the question at hand was actually

If You Had To Pick a Single CCTV Brand To Sell And It Could Not Be Chinese, What Would It Be?

But as the ONLY brand I would sell, it seems risky. Better to choose a brand that has a mid-priced and low-priced lines as well.

So, I'm ok if its the only brand I would own, but not ok with it being the only brand I would sell.

That's a good point.

I would add the 'single' requirement is somewhat unrealistic as most integrators carry two lines because it often better to have a dedicated lower and high end option. Related: Average Number of Camera Lines Integrators Carry

I would add the 'single' requirement is somewhat unrealistic...

Yes.

IMHO, the OP's 'single' requirement came from wanting to look at alternatives to Chinese companies, either that or he is just randomly excluding them from consideration.

And if he is looking for Western alternatives, Geuterbreck isn't much of a substitute, for the reasons already stated.

On the other hand if he wants simply to know the best brand in any price range, why exclude the Chinese?

Actually, while it was not my intent when I posted this but it is an interesting discussion when it comes to Federal projects. They have fairly strict limits on where you can buy from on my contracts and Chinese stuff is a non-starter.

Actually, while it was not my intent when I posted this...

Intent. Do tell.

There was none, it was just a random thought and I could not come up with a decent answer so I threw it out to the masses. I think it has been a very interesting conversation, which is exactly what I was hoping to see. There are 9 or 10 viable choices on this list so far, that is pretty neat!

Concerns like security should be important to anyone providing surveillance.

Why don't you check out DHS website if you want to know how many cyber hits on US companies, government buildings, per day by China.

Why should anyone want to exclude Chinese made products when it comes to security?

Not a question.

40 replies and no one is going with a Pelco or Vicon?

Vicon may be on the rebound and would likely provide an Integrator with more market and project pricing protection than some of the others (like Axis who signs up anyone, as one example).

Pelco, still not sure they are ready for prime time...

We have a partner that is a pretty large Vicon integrator, I actually forgot all about them. That is a reasonable option.

What about someone like IndigoVision? Not the largest product line, and no thermals that I am, aware of but they seem to have a decent product with decent support... or am I wrong on that?

Good point on Vicon. Plus Eric Fullertson is a great guy. Very in touch with the marketplace and I do believe he would be willing to partner up to grow the company. Not a product I am interested in but I do keep my eye on them.

Not so good of a point with Pelco. Pelco is held back by their desire (or is it a need?) to support legacy product under their current systems.

Acti

Ok, I must ask why. I rarely use their stuff, but the product line does not seem well suited for large projects at all.

We used their product on a 3000 plus camera job in Oklahoma , no issues

we used their product on 1 of largest 5 retailers including their CMS , works great

suggest you take a closer look

Fair enough!

FWIW, ACTi is from the Republic of China, not to be confused with the People's Republic of China.

Garry, your email address says you work at ACTi. Can you clarify? If you are an ACTi employee, 'using' them does not count.

FLIR

You are the second person to choose FLIR, care to explain your decision?

Person emailed us accidentally. Response:

"American made and high quality."

Of course, a lot of FLIR, especially the Lorex and lower end stuff is Chinese made.

High quality American made marketing.

FLIR reps say whatever will help them sell the product

Flir is great for Infrared but their new low end is CHINESE made. Everyone knows this.

It would have to be Avigilon for me as the VMS is very good and the cameras, especially the H4 range are very clear and have analytics and Light Catcher for night vision.

Panasonic,

Great quality, very durable, good diverse product line which now includes the Video Insight VMS, amazing technical support(Canada), 5 year warranty on their hardware, easy on bandwidth(especially newer 6 series), competitive pricing compared to Axis, Mobotix, etc... They may be lacking some flavour of the day bells and whistles compared to some other brands but have been my Brand of choice for over 8 years.

How do you feel that their new low end cameras are made by a Communist country.

Call and ask them if you don't believe it.

They are lacking so much in regards to cameras, they are now made in "CHINA".

I don't use low end cameras Panasonic or otherwise.

I have installed several top brands many of which I have been happy with and will use again but will always lead with and fall back on Panasonic I-Pro.

I haven't found any better brand.

Where does the box say their made?