I have a project where the customer needs the cameras for live view only and they need to disable the cameras completely at the push of a button or switch. Is there a POE injector with I/0 which we could connect a button/switch to so we can turn the cameras on/off? Open to other ideas too.
Subscriber Discussion
PoE Injector With Trigger In To Turn PoE On/Off
Brian Karas
Nov 22, 2017Did something similar for a high-profile client in CT several years ago. Ended up with a PoE switch powering the cameras (VideoIQ units) that was tied into a relay out from the alarm panel. He could kill the cameras by disarming the panel with a specific code that also flipped the relay.
If I was doing it today, I would probably strongly consider any of the cheap ($20-$50) wifi-enabled plugs that have a corresponding app (e.g., Wifi controlled outlet). Obviously there are other security concerns with this approach that you will have to factor in for yourself, but the upside is that is does not tie you to specific PoE gear and makes it easier to expand if needed.
U
Undisclosed #3
Dec 08, 2017I'd love to see a PoE switch that integrates with SmartHome systems that can control ports. Sorry kids, no internet until the rooms are clean.
U
Undisclosed #5
Dec 14, 2017I have accomplished this by powering all the WAPs from one Toughswitch, which gets powered from a web-enabled power strip. The Crestron home controller communicates with the power strip via telnet and provides the wifi on/off buttons on touchpanels for the owner. It was a fun exercise, but as it turns out they just leave the wifi on all the time.
UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #1
Nov 22, 2017Use a $6 Sonoff wifi switch. Use the provided app or amazon alexa or google home/assistant control. You just need to take the power cord, cut it and attach it to the terminals. Then you have remote access to turn the device on/off, set schedules, or even timers to automatically turn it off after a set duration of being on.
Sonoff - This is just one of the many sellers out there on Amazon.
MM
Michael Miller
Nov 22, 2017Thank you for the recommendations but I need a "higher end" solution and it needs to be hardwired. My other concern is the time it's going to take for the camera to boot and video to be displayed. I might have to resort to using analog cameras with an encoder. Then use a switch to break power to the analog cameras.
Ethan Ace
Nov 22, 2017Altronix has PoE injectors with a shutdown input. It's a voltage trigger, but you can just split the power wiring for the injector (12-24VAC or VDC) and put a switch on that leg.
I haven't tried this, but see no reason it wouldn't work.
Daniel S-T
Dec 09, 2017We use these. We use a lightswitch as the on-off switch for the PoE. Works great for us. Similar situation as OP, only they do record, just only when the occupant of the office needs/wants it to, not all the time.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 09, 2017How long does it take for your cameras start streaming when they turn the switches on?
Daniel S-T
Dec 09, 2017We use Honeywell cameras, and these particular offices all have HDZ PTZ cameras, not that that should matter, but it does not take long. I don't have exact numbers, I'm never around when they turn on, but it should be the same as a booting up, when I reboot the cameras they are streaming again in under a minute.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 09, 2017U
Undisclosed #2
Nov 22, 2017It sounds like you want a hard-wired local, instant on/off privacy switch.
If so, consider using a POE injector so as to get the power via mode B which puts it on seperate pairs of 4,5,7,8.
Then put a DPST switch on the TX lines of the cable, or 1,2.
That way the camera stays up all the time, and the video mute is certain and instant.
Caveats: The contacts of a off the shelf dpst will introduce an impeadance mismatch on the 1,2 lines. As bad as this sounds, it won’t actually be a problem unless the ethernet run is a longer one. You can put the camera on its own dumb switch locally if necessary.
Also, don’t tell anyone at BICSI :)
UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #1
Nov 22, 2017U
Undisclosed #2
Nov 22, 2017UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #1
Dec 08, 2017I meant that if the camera was operating at 1Gbps, then all pairs are used for data even when used with an injector.
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 10, 2017
Jon Dillabaugh
Dec 10, 2017U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 10, 2017Fair enough.
Though in the case at hand, going thru your typical 10/100 injector would force the camera to communicate at fast ethernet speeds, as it would auto-negotiate.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 08, 2017Finally getting around to testing this.
When powering the camera via 24V and turning power on and off for the camera it takes ~60s for the camera to start streaming in the VMS.
We are going to try powering the camera via POE and breaking the data pairs to see what happens.
Scott Smith
Dec 08, 2017POE is on the Data Pairs. You will have to power the camera local and break the data pairs to keep the camera powered up.
UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #1
Dec 08, 2017Not always. PoE can be on the data or spare pair, depending on 10/100 or 1000 and Mode A/Mode B.
It is up to the PSE to determine which mode to put out.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 08, 2017Ok so keeping the camera powered but breaking the data pairs reduces the connection time to about ~15 but we are seeing some issues as it doesn't look like the VMS likes the cameras connecting and documenting like this.
Scott Smith
Dec 08, 2017MM
Michael Miller
Dec 08, 2017Well, I am trying to get something set up in the VMS rules to put the camera in standby mode or turn on/off the privacy mask. Run a 2 wire to from the switch to the camera. Write a rule when switch "on" enable privacy mask. Second rule when switch "off" disable privacy mask.
Scott Smith
Dec 08, 2017That would be awesome.
just not sure Avigilon is granular enough with their rules.
I have done it plenty of times in Genetec but not Avigilon.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 08, 2017Yea I can't do it within the Avigilon rules yet but that is what feedback is for :)
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 08, 2017Does anyone know if an Axis camera can be programmed internally to do the following?
When trigger input enabled - enable privacy mask
When trigger input disabled - disable privacy mask.
U
Undisclosed #4
Dec 11, 2017Commenting here to follow. Interested to see the results on this. I am not in my office until later in the week or I would test it myself...
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 11, 2017We tested with Axis cameras and there is no option in the rules to control the privacy mask from the I/O inputs.
Anyone know of an IP camera that can control the Privacy mask via rules in the camera?
Kyle Folger
Dec 12, 2017Is this not applicable to Axis cameras any longer? I just saw this post today and I noticed over a month ago an Axis camera in a doctor's office with a standard power switch on the wall that said camera on/off. I then did a search and found the Axis article because I wanted to know how they might have setup that switch on the wall. The article lists the applicable cameras at the bottom. I'm sure you saw this article, but just in case you hadn't.
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 12, 2017That looks like it will work! Thanks... We will give it a try tomorrow and report back.
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 10, 2017we are seeing some issues as it doesn't look like the VMS likes the cameras connecting and documenting like this.
You could try just breaking one pair instead of both, if it’s easy enough to try. Either one should stop TCP/IP (as opposed to UDP).
One may be handled more gracefully. Medium-long shot.
John Bazyk
Nov 22, 2017Michael, check out OVRC. We are testing a couple of their switches now and they seem to work very well. Snap AV sells them. You could also use their WattBox as well to remotely power down the system from the app. You can setup an end user app and a button in the app for them to shut the whole thing down. I am using it at my house not to shut the TV power off on a schedule so my kids don't get up at 4am and turn on the TV...because they were doing it and I caught them on camera! lol
MM
Michael Miller
Nov 22, 2017That looks interesting but I need to have a switch on the wall that is dedicated to turning the camera on/off for that room. A mobile app is not going to work has this has to be very reliable and dead simple for anyone to operate.
John Bazyk
Nov 22, 2017Got it. I think your best bet is going to be going with Analog. Put a light switch in between the camera and the power supply. We used to do that a lot a long time ago. If you want more security, you could throw it on an access door controller and use the door controller to trigger the relay for the power so someone has to scan their card or type in a pin to turn the camera on and off.
Scott Smith
Nov 22, 2017Other than the delay your concerned with a wall switch can kill the 120v to the injector.
What about powering the camera locally instead of POE?
There would still be a boot time though.
MM
Michael Miller
Nov 22, 2017Yea that was my second option. Powering the camera via 12/24 and switching that power.
U
Undisclosed #2
Nov 22, 2017Here’s even simpler.
Get a cheap dumb switch and put it on a power strip. Power the camera via injector or 12/24.
Cycle the switch. They only take a couple seconds to start working.
MM
Michael Miller
Nov 22, 2017I have 4-5 rooms to do with this setup so if I go down this road I would use single injectors connected to one switch. Switch boot time is only part of the issue. I also have to deal with the camera booting and then connecting to the VMS.
U
Undisclosed #2
Nov 22, 2017I also have to deal with the camera booting and then connecting to the VMS.
The idea here is that the camera never turns off, so no booting. How quickly can your VMS react to the network drop and reconnect would have to be tested.
AS
Ashley Schofield
Dec 10, 2017Hey Michael,
What if instead of switching the cameras power or network link, you instead switch the glass in front of the camera on or off ?
https://www.switchglass.com.au/order-a-sample/
You might be able to get some wedge housings for full body cameras made with the switch glass.
Also that way you know that the camera is working as it will have a grey image when the glass is in privacy mode.
Not sure if you would then have focus issues when the glass goes clear.
Another option would be to ask a camera manufacturer to enable full screen privacy mode on IO switch...
Cheers,
Ash
MM
Michael Miller
Dec 10, 2017Funny you bring that up as we build demo like this years ago. It worked well but the housing was too big for the customers liking.
AS
Ashley Schofield
Dec 11, 2017I thought I remembered you doing something like that...
I still think that is the best solution.
Campbell Chang
Dec 11, 2017Why not use some variant of HD analog with an encoder with the switch hardwired to the power supply of the camera.
No delay on boot time as the encoder stays online at all times.
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 11, 2017Why not use some variant of HD analog with an encoder...
Though the problem with these solutions appears to be the ungraceful way in which the VMS deals with the interruption/resumption of the stream/network connection.
Campbell Chang
Dec 11, 2017But the difference between an IP camera and an encoder is that if you kill the power to a camera on an encoder, the encoder still streams and maintains a network connection. It just doesn't have an image. So upon power resumption, the camera image would come back immediately.
This isn't the same as an IP camera which would take it's 30-60 seconds to reboot following power loss or re-establish it's network connection.
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 11, 2017But the difference between an IP camera and an encoder is that if you kill the power to a camera on an encoder, the encoder still streams and maintains a network connection.
Yes, missed that.
Brian Karas
Dec 11, 2017If you could use a camera with a DC-Iris lens then you could interrupt power/signal to the iris control of the lens, which would cause it to close, resulting in a black image.
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 11, 2017Brian Karas
Dec 11, 2017U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 11, 2017AS
Ashley Schofield
Dec 12, 2017What about a recessed motorized box that comes out of the roof when the button pushed ?
https://www.avaustralia.com.au/motorised-mounts/
or a ptz motor that moves the camera to the viewing location, and to turn of it just aims back at the corner ?
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 12, 2017
CH
Corbin Hambrick
Dec 20, 2017There are several solutions out there.
Snap AV sells many items with their technology called OvrC. They are IP controllable and they have a Pro app for dealers to reboot stuff and an consumer app so your customer can do it too. I don't think they have low volt triggers though.
What you are looking for sounds like Digital Loggers might have what you want. I think they have a PoE Midspan with low volt triggers.
RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 25, 2017take a look at our PdbU www.energyreconnect.com
U
Undisclosed #2
Dec 25, 2017RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 26, 2017Cyber Security, in crowd face recognition.
The edge is the power, all technologies are at the edge
Scott Smith
Dec 26, 2017RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 26, 2017well, if you are not familiar with such technologies and market demand, it doesn't mean its spamming. I am more than happy to educate if needed. thanks
JH
John Honovich
Dec 26, 2017Roni, I'll ask then. What deep learning or 'crowd face recognition' is being done in your products? Which one? How?
RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 26, 2017john, we have a few types of our patented platform. the high-end PdbU has built in a very powerful CPU that host our own embedded software such as:
deep learning - we have our own algorithm that studies a wireless mess network and knows to allocate resources to high demand users from none active users, it's a very powerful tool for wireless IoT endpoints.
Face recognition you can have 1 to 1 (whitelist), a very easy task and well used by many companies/endpoints or 1 to many in a crowd, (blacklist) very complicated to pull out a suspect out of a crowd such airports, sports events and so one.
Cyber IP Gatekeeper, being the first line of defense our cyber software blocks hackers hacking the backend via surveillance cameras or wifi AP and so on.
our PdbU is located back to back with the endpoint, powered by the PoE power and offers always on at any condition.
thanks,
JH
John Honovich
Dec 26, 2017Scott Smith
Dec 26, 2017What does your post have to do with the OP turning a camera of and on remotely without killing the network connection.
RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 26, 2017it's in final testing and its made by an Israeli company for us.
RH
Roni Herzel
Dec 27, 2017scott, why won't you read the beginning to find your answer.
thanks,
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