"The Company The Industry Always Feared Would Arrive" Is Here

Totally agree.

Fixed.

Agreed. We've done this model before. IP cams are making things somewhat easier, but there is a reason that full blown video surveillance systems have never taken off in the residential market. That being said, some industry analysts predict that 1 in 5 homeonwers wants to add a camera to their home within the next year. Someone is going to help them. Hopefully it is us, and hopefully you guys grab some of that coming revenue. If the markets start to change, meet the change and take the revenue and profits that come with the expanding arena.

Agreed in part. We're not competitors for the hard core, professional contracts. The small business is where we see a need, and at some point that yields to the mid and large size jobs which are the bread and butter of the industry, and that won't change. We'll not be doing RFP's for the types of jobs that the industry is built on. We only provide fill in work to keep your crews and schedules full.

I tend to agree.

In the early 2000's I was at another startup that was at the forefront (a little too early...) for the networked DVR concept. We had a media server device that could hold MP3's, record TV shows (like a Tivo), and act as a home gateway/router. Plus a few other things (caller ID overlay on TV, IM on TV so you could "watch" a show with friends).

We did a few beta programs with Sears, Rogers cable, and Speakeasy (the ISP), and installed probably 250 boxes in the US and Canada, from Seattle to Dallas to Toronto and places in between.

Some jobs we could be in and out in 2 hours (running RG6 to a couple of rooms and reconfiguring DSL router or cable modem settings), and other houses took 2 days to complete. Even in the same neighborhood it was a crapshoot house to house how long it would take.

I think the flat-rate install concept is compelling. People like knowing how much stuff will cost up front, and many homeowners are likely to be afraid of wiring up even a simple plug-n-play system. But given where component pricing is today, you could probably sell these systems for $2899 installed and everyone would make enough money to stay interested in doing more business.

We're simply proposing to send you more installations to leverage the existing assets you already own. Hopefully you get more work, hire more people and/or fill your schedules with this fill-in work, and this becomes bonus work for your already existing physical and labor assets. Should be win/win/win.

The fixed expenses you have invested in put you in position to even better leverage your investments for easy pick-up work like this. If the work is profitable, you'd probably want it if it means your teams work more, and maybe you can eventually even hire more if you want to.

Not to mention the installer assumes all the risk for little reward. Not a great business model.

We have jobs that need installers. Absent of us, the jobs don't exist. We provide incremental work, not taking a slice of an existing pie. The industry is going to grow exponentially, and we're carving out new business and bringing that to installation partners. We're zero percent interested in the types of installs and installers represented above.

Agreed 100% on both fronts.

We're here to work FOR the professionals. We're here to facilitate hopefully new business, new revenues, and new jobs. That is the only way this really works.

Consumers will flush this out.

and down.

Some of that may come our way, and we'd need people like you to make it happen. Even when stuff is WAY over our head, it still would be nice to be able to send it to you.

Circuit's FireDog could never fix what plagued Circuit. We were actually an installer for Circuit on a regional basis, filling in where they had gaps in coverage.

Wal-Mart is still doing installations, now with NEW who owns the company that I started. The installation offering you are referring to was the company I started and then sold, and it's still exists in Wal-Mart today (although not profitable). It was commoditized by Wal-Mart and NEW, specifically NEW offered it to them to insulate their real business (selling warranties).

We'll serve up the scope of work. I understand you passing if I send you something unprofitable, but I am surprised you would pass before you even know what we have, even job by job... unless you don't have the extra bandwidth (understandable). Also totally get it if your business model and expansion doesn't want this type of commoditized/homogenized work.

I do think in some markets there will be some aberrations. It was easier in consumer electronics to serve up a flat rate job than it is in video surveillance, for sure. However, if we keep things towards the higher end on the sliding scale, we know there will be some cost averaging. If I send you eight great jobs, one mediocre job, and one shitty job, hopefully they all end up making sense for you. We have in the past dealt with the exceptions separately. If the exceptions end up being every job, we have trouble. :-)

Experience says that there are some great ones, some decent ones, and some shitty ones. Our job is to flush as much of the shitty ones out on the front side, identify the aberrations, and treat them as such.

But you are totally right.

I was talking with a Sam's Club executive about the old days of "wireless" CCTV systems. While it is better now than it was then, we're still a long way from flawless. Most of our commercial/business installations will still be wired, but PoE making that an easier proposition even now than it was.

But I agree.

Yes. You're right.

The bridge for us is using the installation model to get the product placed at retail, and coming up with competitive product offers to unseat some of the opening price point systems and configurations currently at retail.

The products we have now were just some easy placeholders.

Ultimately, we don't simply want to be a service provider for retail, but a service aggregator for YOU and a way to channel new fuel into you as installers. That can come from several sources, retail being one of them.

We work for you.

Thanks for your opinion. As you know, I am new to the IPVM arena, but I have appreciated the insights from everyone that took the time to post here.

We'll do everything we do with integrity and transparency. We're after a different sector of the industry growth than most of you specialize in, but I have learned a ton from you none the less.

We're not taking any sales away from integrators (unless you assume you're talking with everyone we're talking with) and we're not sticking any integrator with any job they don't want.

One in five households in the United States intends to get a camera or more put into their residence next year. We'd like to figure out how to help as many of them as we can.

The conversation here has steered primarily towards residential. Many (most?) of the retailers we are working towards are more small business inclined than residential. Our business will probably be slanted more towards small business than residential, but the residential business is forecasted to be pretty strong and we want it where we can get it, and get it profitably for all involved.

There's a market VOID that needs to be filled. We're going to fill it. You're assuming it is covered by the existing way the market has provided products in this arena. It's not. The work we have isn't taking work from you, but you passing on work before you even know what it is... IS taking you out of the discussion before you even know what you are turning down.

I don't think we will win you ALL, and I don't mean to devalue you or your work. I am sure it is worth every dollar.

The perfect installers for us are the small to small/mid with a few extra holes in their schedule on a regular basis. I need you to send your best guy out there for me, not necessarily YOU. I probably can't afford you.

No one is holding a gun to anyone's head forcing them to take the rates he is paying. You accept it or you don't. This may have already been mentioned or said, this has generated so many comments it's hard keeping up, but to me it seems somewhat similar to OnForce for IT work. It's very little pay for flat rate work and nobody but the owners of OnForce gets rich on it. But lots people take jobs from OnForce because it's a source of "filler" work- making some money during the times you don't have paying work going on so at least your making something in between the times you make better money. Better to make something during those in between times than zero.

I've become pretty good at cherry picking jobs already. This just saves me the time of closing.

As far as quality of gear goes, that is a concern of mine. I won't waste my time banging my head against the wall. If I take a flyer on an install and things go south, no big loss. I won't take another. I don't have much to lose. They will either make it worth our time or they won't retain anything other than slammers. David seems to be aware of this fact. I trust he wants to make this a profitable endeavor, not a pump and dump.

As I've gotten older and especially going around looking for a house to buy, more and more I notice the wires run around on the outside of houses, older telephone and now coax cable TV, in shoddy fashion that you may not be noticed at a glance but is glaringly there when you really look.

These days crews doing resi work for CATV and DSL installs are typically told to NOT try and fish cable through walls. This is partly for time savings, but also for liability reasons. Less holes cut in drywall for outlet boxes or low-voltage rings, and less poking around in walls with fish tape and rods minimizes chances of snagging other wiring, plumbing, etc.

And, I also saw the same thing you did in terms of customers not caring about visible wiring. Many times they don't even know that it's possible to hide wiring for new runs, so they just assume wire stapled to the house is the only solution.

Here's an updated link for you, including including a link to the FTC article the quote is discussing.

www.linkedin.com/hp/update/6131094221593075713

The sign up form requires your insurance carrier and policy number.

Who wants residential customers call at night and weekend that they cannot access their live cameras or recordings...

Installers who don't answer their phone nights and weekends. ;)