Testing Hikvision High End Camera

Ethan:

It would be great for next time: if you can please test the "behaviour" of the camera streaming under the iVMS-4500 mobile app using iPhone iOS/Android. I think one of the main complains and dissatisfactions (as far as my experience goes with my end users) is the sloooow video motion when accesing the LIVE VIEW of Megapixel cameras under 3G / 4G cellphone providers like Sprint, Verizon, etcetera....

for high end I was expecting DS-2DE5186 or something like that

I am curious about your perspective on the build quality of the product when compared to Axis, Bosch, Pana, Sony. Aside from sensor /ISP combo's that may be similar among cameras, did you notice an improved build quality (fit/finish) that could justify the higher prices of the other cameras? For example using Japanese lens versus Chinese lens, smoothness of gimbal movement etc. I know this may be subjective but part of the reason for choosing some of the other brands at premium prices would be the reliability of the product over an extended period of time

Hi,

Just curious why Samsung has such significant improvement in low light compared to Bosch and Sony. Is it because SSNR was turning off in the previous test?

Samsung Test -- Less Than 1 lux.jpg

Integrated IR vs non-integrated -- Large.jpg

Hi Guys, Thanks for the report. Very interesting. One question please. My team advises me that the 3MP camera by default runs at 2MP and looks great. However, if you actually switch it to 3MP (which it is publicised as such but defaulted to 2MP), the camera's performance deteriorates. As it is a 3MP camera, this may be misleading? Your thoughts and did you test this?

Thanks.

Dear IPVM crew, thanks a lot for all your work. It's amazing how easily you bring myths down.

It's also surprising low light performance on Panasonic SFV631 model, as it is supposed to be new line high end camera.

You think it's because unchanged default settings are not the best?

You also forget to mention the built in analytics in the 4 Series cameras which other cameras at similar price do not have.

Ethan- I agree our model numbers are long but you just need the secret decoder ring. CD (camera, digital); 4 - 4-series; 1 - Indoor; 32 - 3MP; FWD - true WDR; I- IR; Z Motorized Zoom.- See- it is easy :)

We will also have a 1080p WDR version coming out soon.

Hi

I do find the Hikvision (they should change the name :) ) cameras extremely good in term of image quality. IMHO this camera has better image than all of the others. notice the quality of the letter on all the pictures .. no smearing in good lighting , same with lowlightin , dfintion is preserved.

In my personla experience they work extremely wellbut it seems that QC is not the best, i have ahd some fail very quickly in the field a few hours or days after install. I am looking seriously to standardize on these as they provide a superior Picture Quality IMO for a good price this camera for example has IT integrated and great WDR ... beter than all the other cameras not the euphemistic "In full light, the 4132 provides details similar to other cameras in this test with no major issues.". it is not similar it is clearly better, the chart is legible up to line 7 and the licnse plate very clear... Clors are off but so are the others and in the absence of a clear color reference we can't tell.

Let me say that I am now a fan of this brand. They are posied to dominate, with such results and price this is the direction in which they are headed.

Thanks for the usual great reviews

One of my most promising features of these cameras, that wasn't addressed is their embedded video analytics. I have one of the value series cameras on my desk right now testing it, it works well. Hikvision tells me its not quite ready but will be soon. I have seen a lot of improvements over the last 2 or 3 firmware updates.

On the Value cameras, so DS-2CD2112 , DS-2CD2712, DS-2CD2732 etc etc there is firmware version 5.2.0, this enables 1 transversing line and 1 intrusion area so not as much as the 4 series cameras but still very powerful and there very good analytics for the price, look for the firmware and give it a go its excellent

One of the main selling points to me was the accuracy, even on the lower end models, of their motion algorithm. In many other brands, it just does not work and you end of insuring your project with more storage and continuous recording. I have to admit that their low light pro outdoor dome (1.3 MP) provides stunning images (without agc and slow shutter) and a project last week with a bunch of Hik PTZ via wireless in a city brought ooohs and ahhhhs at night ($750 exterior HD PTZ??). (I know the drug dealers will destroy them eventually).

Thanks for test results. However I thnik you should to compare box vs. box or dome vs. dome cameras rahter than dome vs. box. I am talking about the lens which is very importand at MP cams - comparisions should be done with the same lens model.

Does 2,8-12mm lens used by HIKVISION dome cams has spartial resolution siutable for 3MP sensor??

Domes have always lens bulid-in but it is more precise to compare between vendors dome vs. dome rather then dome vs. box.

Regarding spartial resolution of the lens - I just wanted to know whether your tests showed 3MP image (details of the image) form HIK camera is the same useful like form 3MP cams of other vendors.

Hi John,

Excellent testing. Will it be possible for your team to do a similar testing on Dahua models?

Thanks.

What about the network side? Did you do a scan, did the camera crash? Did it "phone home" like a lot of other Chinese cameras?

No! They don't phone home.. They just work. For the price, they are worth testing on one's own lab. Once you see the results the price will shock you. You will be hard presseed to pay more for the so-called high-end cameras. These high-end manufacturers better step-up their games. The challenge is that serious IMHO. Have a look at their DS-CD-2132 and prepare yourself for <$200 to be seriously impressed even when compared to High End cameras plus now they have analytics built-in ..

It has become customary to just dismis the Chinese manufacturers .. Remind me that back in the 60s "Made in Japan" was synonimous with "Bad Quality" ... No more ...

[IPVM Note: Poster is an Axis employee]

John, in the mail from IPVM listing the topics of discussion and links to them, this is the link to this test/discussion:

Testing Hikvision High End Camera vs Axis

If you are not going to test against Axis, why do you use Axis brand? In the same way you don't allow using IPVM contents for third party marketing purposes, you shouldn't use manufacturer's brand to attract readers (if that is the aim).

On the other hand, and from my point of view, I would discuss what is considered as high end camera, is that because of the 3MP? Then is resolution what defines what is high end? In Axis our top line cameras are included in the Q-line series. I understand you have to compare apples to apples but why is the key point the resolution? could it be better image quality with 2MP, or HDTV 720p? Why not comparing adaptive IR cameras?

When comparing image quality you show a good sort of test captures, why when you are asked about how solid is / looks the hardwar you just reply with a pesonal impression: "I don't think one felt significantly higher or lower quality than the others." (Ethan words). Why don't you show actual images of the hardware and let the readers have their own perception?

Despite of many of my colleagues and partners who have historically claimed about IPVM biased treatment to Axis, I have always defended the right of IPVM for doing independant and external analysis, and I have found several times good comments from you about Axis as a market leader and products or features being considered as competitive or high quality offer. However, this article / test looks more a "promo" to position Hikvision in the so called "high end" segment rather than a fair comparison of features or products whic has been an appreciated practice in IPVM during years.

Thanks for your reply John, I understand mistakes as I do also some of them more often than desired. Anyway, if Axis is not included in the comparison, it shouldn't be also mentioned in the price positioning as well since price has to be linked to performance otherwise it could be considered..... say unfair?

Regarding the concept of high end, it is of course very subjective to everyone's criteria. Yes, WDR, motorised lens and built in IR may indicate that is high end, it is not entry level at all, but the way they perform and how they are built is also important to se how "high" is the positioning of the camera. In Axis, we have those features in the P-line products, which is not our highest performance line of products.

On the other hand, if those are the points to qualify the camera as high end, then the side to side comparison and in depth details should focus on that. It's the case in some way for the WDR test, but I can'ts see the same level of benchmarking for the other topics respect to the selected competitors.

The videos show the Hikvision product hardware, but not the competitors', only in the size (pure external look) comparison. I think the question posted was about differences in robustness of the whole product with the competitors.

Once it is clarified that the test is not against Axis, I wouldn't want to judge about how fair is it respect to the other competitors since that's the job for them. However, as a reader, it would have been interesting to know comparison details such as streaming performance (there's a comment about reducing quality when using 3MP), type of lens (is it P-iris?, how fast and easy is the autofocus?). What's the MTBF for the leds being used?, What's the anti vandal protection rating? things like that I guess may be relevant when playing in the "high end" league.

My impression is that the tests put the eye on features where Hikvision has filled the gap with higher quality competitors while skipping others where there's still some way to catch up. That's usually a kind of "promo" .But of course this is again subjective.

John, take it easy, I have my own responsibilities in Axis Southern Europe that do not include to make propaganda in IPVM, I'm not paid for making Axis promotion at IPVM. I'm participating as IPVM subscriber and of course as part of the IP video industry, isn't it the aim of the blog? If all professional being paid by manufactures cannot make comments or are not credible, I don't think there will be many left to continue with the blog.

Just to complement information for the IPVM subscribers, P-Iris, although first introduced by Axis (like some other video features being used by most of the competitors) is not Axis proprietary nor an Axis patent and it is currently maketed by Axis' competitors like Samsung or Vivotek and lens manufacturers like Computar among others. Therefore it is in no way Axis propaganda.

I haven't claimed P-Iris is better or worse than other technology John and as independant analyst you may consider it with no value after your test. There are many web sites and blogs with different discussions and opinions in the net about this. I was just saying that it might be interesting to know if the type of lens Hikvision is using is of that type or not.

Regarding the test, as in any other industry I think they should have some differences when applying to different product positioning, as the expectation and request from the buyer is supposed to be different as well. That's my point and I have just dropped some topics that could be tested or reported at least. Anyway you run the tests and I give my feedback, just in the same way Axis makes the products and you judge them.

Please read again my post, I haven't said you are biased against "the company that pays my salary" (Axis), I have started by saying that once the test is not against Axis I cannot judge how fair it is. My feed back has been instead that in my opinion it is some favourable to Hikvision compared to the other participants in the test (Axis is not in the test).

The only part where I have repeated the term "unfair" after your recognition of the mistake referring Axis is when I suggest to remove a price reference in test report without the correspondant performance reporting, and I still think this is something to avoid in future analysis.

It says something when other manufacturer's have to put Hikvision down, the fact Hikvision have taken the market worldwide by storm and offer an astonishing range is quite breath taking to be honest ( and no i dont work for Hikvision)

John, you are more than welcome to run the type of tesst you find interesting. Again, Axis and other manufacturers build cameras and you make tests, we are subject to third party judment as so you are.

If my perception is that a test looks favourable to Hikvision (in this case) it doesn't mean at all you are paid by Hikvision, don't put those words in my mouth. In the same way it is clear and public that I'm paid by Axis, the only thing that is clear for me is that IPVM (you) is paid by the subscribers (i.e. me) nothing else. As a sales man in your previous life, you know that there might be many other professional or personal motivations to do things or favor a brand, starting from just a wrong approach without any further intention.

I use to read the test produced by IPVM and find them very often of high value in my job, but when they don't like me, I just say it. I will continue to read tests as long as they interest me involving Hikvision or others and hope to find them as intersting as usual.

I wouldn't like to make this an Axis - Hikvision fight (we already compete with them in the market as with many others) rather than a critic to a singular job issued by IPVM that I feel allowed to do.

For that, if you want to run specific tests between Axis and Hikvision, I guess that some other maufacturers would like to have the same chance and publicity. But that's up to you and your strategy in communication.

Looking at your plans, I see some concerns in defining "the best camera" since as you know that will depend on "what for". We are daily runing benchmarking comparisons at customer sites against many manufacturers and even with our "best champion camera" sometimes we win and sometimes we lose. It always depends on customer's expectation and request for a specific aplication. Anyway I undersatand you have to perform generic test about specific features and performances and issue the results. That's fine if the test are adequated to the type of camera and product positioning, but one of my personal advices is to actually test some of the specs in the manufacturer's datasheets because many times there are very different ways to understand how a spec is being measured.

In response to F Distributor, it has not been me to focus the discussion on Hikvision, it was just that the article / test of IPVM was titled Hikvision vs. Axis.

Hikvision is a strong competitor to Axis as there are others and there have been others in previous years. If they have taken the market or not, is a question for analysts and research institutes.

IF they have taken the market or not???????

The market place shows they have run away with it, hence why there the largest in the world in cctv manufacturer, you dont get there without numbers

Good John. I look forward for that shootout. I'm sure my colleagues will do their job in the US.