Advanced VMD - Axis / Mobotix Tested

In reply to James Talmage

Has VMS integration improved since 9 months ago?

When you say the VMS doesn't support it, does that mean you can't configure it from the VMS, or that it won't help the VMS detect motion better at all?

Ethan Ace

•Jun 03, 2014

Hey James, good question. I'll check with Axis.

In the VMSs we used, "not supported" meant that the VMS simply did integrate motion events from VMD 2.1. They use a different API. It's actually surprising that more haven't integrated it.

James Talmage

•Jun 03, 2014

IPVMU Certified

Apparently Exacq can be made to support VMD 2.1.

The integration is somewhat less than user friendly.

(my submission for understatement of the year).

Rob Herrington

•Nov 03, 2014

IPVMU Certified

In reply to Rob Herrington

I see that Axis has now come out with VMD 3.0

What improvements did you see with that?

Reactions:

John Honovich

•Nov 03, 2014

IPVM

Rob, do you have a link to Axis VMD3.0? I do not recall any formal announcement of it.

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Undisclosed #3

•Nov 03, 2014

Overview | Axis Communications - at the bottom:

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Earlier releases

For those products that don’t support VMD 3 AXIS Video Motion Detection 2.1 is still available. AXIS Video Motion Detection 2.1 is based on the same reliable motion detection technology, but does not include False Alarm Filtering and visual configuration support.

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Mark Fiscella

John, it is all about signal to noise ratio in those low light scenes. Until you have cameras that have a better SNR in low illumination the software will have trouble with identification. Keep up the good work you are doing your test pictures are worth a thousand words.

John Honovich

In reply to Mark Fiscella

IPVM

Mark, the main camera we tested was an Axis P 'Lightfinder' series, which is one of the best low light, non IR cameras in the market, so that should underscore the difficulties.

Horace Lasell

We've been considering another small scale implementation of less than 10 cameras. We think VMD is an important component.

We believe that VMD benefits to total ownership costs are much more substantial than the one-time system procurement cost benefit it delivers through reduced storage sizing. When reliable VMD presents non-real-time reviewers with a high percentage of "valid" motion events, this personnel cost driver which extends over the life of the system can be greatly mitigated.

Thanks for another informative review that is relevant to our immediate needs.

Luis Carmona

Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

This is a nice start, but rather than seeing how much better Axis' advanced VMD is than their basic VMD, I'd rather see how Axis' advanced VMD does say against Sony's DEPA, or Samsung's VMD, or some VMS's advanced VMD looking at the same scene.

And how VideoIQ does against say AgentVI or IOImage looking at the same scene.

John Honovich

IPVM

In reply to Luis Carmona

Luis, what cameras are claiming advanced VMD? We can easily test against others but are there specific models that are known (via test/field performance) to be highly robust against false positive motion events?

Luis Carmona

Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

From the sound of it, though I may be wrong, the Axis VMD sounds like something that would be comparable to Sony's DEPA, which I consider to be a step up from basic activity detection, but below Video Analytics (which actually tries to identify objects and object intentions), which I don't have the impression Axis VMD is on the same level. Same for some Samsung cameras. Anything that has vectored, sizable boxes with some options like trip line and directional alerting I consider a step up from activity detection.

John Honovich

IPVM

In reply to Luis Carmona

Axis VMD2.1 does not support any lines or rules. It's meant to be better motion detection, period.

Sony and Samung are marketed differently, with rules/events. However, the key question is how well the underlying detection works. I have not heard anything positive about that, even from those manufacturers.

Axis has cross line detection which is likely more comparable to Sony DEPA. We are testing Axis cross line and can try it against DEPA (Ethan/Derek)

Ethan Ace

In reply to Luis Carmona

Does Sony still include DEPA in Gen 6? I thought it was now "VMF" or something like that. It looks like it includes cross line as well as simply "object detected" analytics, according to the manual (page 30).

Luis Carmona

Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

I admit I'm not sure myself on that one. (DEPA in Gen 6)

Mike McCann

Ethan - Sony Gen5-V, Gen6-V and Gen6-E series all have both VMD and VMF. (All other cameras have VMD, but not the VMF menu.) Basically, you can place a Video Motion Filter (VMF) inside any VMD area. This is the DEPA Advanced solution you setup in the camera menu. Many recording platforms can use VMD and/or VMF as event triggers.

Undisclosed

Another reason to use lighting to improve analytics in low light levels. There will never be a replacement for good lighting!

RJ Spurr

IPVMU Certified

I am looking at proposing Mobotix just for this new and improved analytic. What I wish these vendors could provide is some kind of guideline which correlates PPF and analytic performance?!

Yes there are many variables which will affect actual results - however a decent starting reference point assuming 'ideal' conditions would be nice.

Mark, above comment, mentioned SNR in relation to performance. I'd like to understand that more. What exact signal, and what exact noise?

Mike Davis

In reply to RJ Spurr

RJ I have used the new MxActivity sensor down to .3 lux in color according the sensor on the camera with no problem using the new M15 series Mobotix cameras. Detection is very acurate. In fact we installed these for the local water management district to self monitor and the detection and notifications have been so good they have turned off thier false alarm prone security systems with perimeter beam detectors. They tell me this will save them thousands in false alarm fines. The test above was taken using the Q24 in 360 mode instead of on the wall in 180 mode which is a better application for the analytics. Also if lighting is a concern the new M15 has much better low light performance than the Q24.

John Honovich

IPVM

In reply to Mike Davis

360 is the most common mode for fisheye / panoramic cameras, ergo our test setup.

That said, it's pretty clear that both analytics worked impressively so long as the camera has sufficient lighting. Whether it's a different model that's better in low light or using IR, that should go along way.

RJ Spurr

IPVMU Certified

In reply to Mike Davis

Mike,

That is promising! I have scoped the M15 5MP cameras. 1 color lens, 1 b&W lens.

Can you explain the 'fines' they receive for false alarms? So they had a traditional perimeter beam detection system? I looked at that for this application initially

Harold Baumgarten

Great article, I would also like to see a VMD 2.1 test on the Axis Q16xx series, considering their WDR plus low light capabilities

Ethan Ace

In reply to Harold Baumgarten

Harold, the P3354s we used are indeed Lightfinder. They're not WDR like the Q1604, but they perform similarly in low light. I'll add this to the post, thanks for pointing it out.

Undisclosed Manufacturer #2

•Aug 30, 2013

We have been using DEPA already since the begingin with cs-50,and then ch-140 and now the ch-180 with milestone to trigger start/stop recordings in an outdoors environment. For us its a huge money and time saver, since we pay per used GB in storage and it gives us the ability to store high quality pictures (16 fps, 2mb/sec, mpeg-4). Timesaver when we go through recordings since i only stores when something moves in a predefined area. It comes with the camera so you dont need to pay any extras, its already there. Not using it (where its aplplicable) seems a waste to me. You just need to set it up and it saves you time and money.

Granted its not "perfect" and we set the parameters so we rather get a little bit more recordings, but still..

It works great for us.

//Snowman

Mike Davis

RJ,

They had many false alarms according to the police which resulted in fines year after year. The result of foliage, animals and what I think was a faulty installtion, but they did not ask me to fix it so I offered the video solution, which quite frankly is much better anyway. I have filtered out all external causes, sun blow out, leaves, trees, rain, shadows etc. The only activations they have had have been real movement and they get notified by email within 20 seconds of the event for varification. They already caught one intruder who was a homeless person. If you wish to get further info or setup details you can email me at mike@dfs-group.net.

Mike Davis