Subscriber Discussion

What Products Would You Like To See Come To Market From Dahua?

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 24, 2016
Independent

Thus far, my entire directive since starting with SavvyTech has been to make our company more nimble and responsive to the overall market. I also hope to pass some of that insight from the market back to the manufacturer itself.

Moderators permitting, I hope to conduct a bit of market research from the more seasoned members here and offer the entire quarter 4 menus from Dahua for members to suggest to me to bring to market.

We are open to change and we aren't afraid to give a chance to products that have enough demand behind it.

So what we have to work with is the international website itself (that loves to break my product links cause everything keeps changing [makes updating my hyperlinked price/spec lists a bitch and a half]), the IP Video Product Selection 2016 Ver.4 catalog, the HDCVI Product Selection 2016 Ver.4 catalog, and a few more items that I may or may not be at liberty to go into more detail about (like LPR/ANPR solutions, access control, and thermal imaging products).

The point is, if enough of you want it, I can try and make it happen!

Also, please feel free to leave any other constructive feedback or input.

Basically, a good format here would be to pick your top 5 - 10 most used products (or their Dahua equivalents in this case) and a bonus item you've had a decent amount of niche demand for that most distributors have left you high and dry for in that particular regard.

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Abdelhamid Metwally
Oct 24, 2016
IPVMU Certified

Dahua probably needs to build an enterprise level VMS, or better still purchase an existing VMS company.

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 24, 2016
Independent

We do have VMS solutions in the form of the DSS software and hardware (DSS4004 and DSS7016D available). We also have video walls to go with that (M70-E is what I have experience with). It just isn't part of our public catalog in the USA, but there is definitely pricing to go with it so it's more than just for show. Would you prefer this to be on the general catalog?

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Abdelhamid Metwally
Oct 24, 2016
IPVMU Certified

I believe that the DSS4004 and DSS7016D are a bit limited in terms of features and scalability in terms of other Enterpise VMS solutions out there. In addition, it would really be appreciated if there is integration between you other solutions ( for example video intercom and access control) as that would be a strong selling point.

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 26, 2016
Independent

So I have mulled over an answer and with my current level of knowledge in the use of Dahua's DSS, I'd be inadequate to answer your questions. HOWEVER, I came up with a solution to answer both of our burning questions on Dahua's native VMS solutions! I'll bug my favorite Dahua engineer to produce some product demonstration videos! So, come up with some questions about how the VMS works and what you want to know about it and I'll have Tohan make some videos if I haven't already bugged her enough.

Oh and FYI, evidently DSS and the free SmartPSS does integrate with our access control and video intercom options. Hopefully, soon we'll all have video demos of that and any features that could make and break DSS for us all to see and judge for ourselves and maybe we can use this opportunity to tell Dahua how to make their software better!

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Undisclosed #1
Oct 26, 2016
IPVMU Certified

Any chance that we'll see less of this type bargain basement branding come to market from Dahua?

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 26, 2016
Independent

I'm just a distributor, bro.

And Dahua can't do it solo either. Policing their distributors and all of the channels thereafter is fine and dandy, but then you need to ask, "will the rest of the Chinese competition follow suit?" All it takes is a few hungry, unscrupulous companies to drag us all back to the price wars. In the end, it's all survival of the fittest out there.

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Undisclosed #1
Oct 26, 2016
IPVMU Certified

I'm just a distributor, bro.

Sorry, I was going off of:

...feel free to leave any constructive feedback or input...I also hope to pass some of that insight from the market back to the manufacturer itself...

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 26, 2016
Independent

I mean I can tell them, but how much power do you think they have against all the other guys bringing prices down too? They may be part of the problem, but they alone can't really make a solution. If they go against the current, they'll lose out against the already looming threat of Hikvision and really, that's pretty tough as it is. "At least they stop being part of the problem" doesn't make them the solution nor will it pay their bills.

Assume Dahua does successfully control their products so they don't reach Amazon and people don't reveal pricing and all that jazz. GREAT! Now what about the companies they have to compete against in CHINA that DGAF (don't give a ****)? Third parties start taking their market share and overall by not being able to produce and move product at volume as much, Dahua won't be able to control production costs and then the spiral downward continues and Dahua drops down to third place and China and Dahua won't be able to compete anymore.

Additionally, let's be truthful here, if Dahua were to successfully do as you asked, the price war will still never end and Dahua would end up with less sales. Human nature will default to wanting to get more for less.

Really the camera market in China is as capitalistic as it gets with only one exception of a government run business that's cheap. However, if you notice, they somehow aren't the only market force in China. You have EVEN cheaper in the form of XiongMai and a ton of other eager manufacturers ready to take business away from anyone, anyway they can.

So rather than the same complaint we've all heard before, do you have a solution that Dahua can implement WITHOUT losing money? I'm all ears, but until there's a realistic solution they'll just say they're doing all they can. And really that's all they can do while staying in business.

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Undisclosed #1
Oct 26, 2016
IPVMU Certified

You have EVEN cheaper in the form of XiongMai...

Isn't that the fallen company from the DDOS scandal? How much cheaper are they?

Sure their cameras can pump out data faster than all heck, and remote administration is a breeze, but should Dahua consider them much of a threat?

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 26, 2016
Independent

XiongMai is basically cheap enough and will customize your housings to the point where you get to claim yourself as the manufacturer. This is WHY they spread out enough to be a threat in the first place. They've sold enough product where Dahua can see them as a clear threat.

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Undisclosed #1
Oct 26, 2016
IPVMU Certified

XiongMai is basically cheap enough...

Had you even heard of XiongMai before the botnet? I hadn't.

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Ethan Ace
Oct 26, 2016

Has someone at Dahua actually named them as a clear threat to you? They have not in my conversations with them. The only competitors they really felt they had were Hikvision and, distantly, Uniview.

Moreover, Xiongmai is predominantly a component supplier. The Ju Feng brand (their actual assembled product) doesn't seem to have any recognition whatsoever. TVT and Longse seemed to be about the only small brands anyone really mentioned to us.

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 26, 2016
Independent

Longse is mentioned with disgust often enough. TVT is pretty much nearly a non-issue, especially in the states. We have some Relong and Zhongxi third party models. There's also Huisun lately (I think we have one). I've heard about XiongMai a little and got a refresher course when the big story broke. Then I got a look at their actual volume numbers, which do incite a bit of pressure.

As far as threats, I'm selling within the American market, where Dahua is just breaking in with their branded stuff. We don't have to deal with any Chinese side threats as an American distributor so I haven't sat in on that meeting. I at least know the names and I know a bit about the numbers war.

Basically, Dahua knows it wants to play in the international field, but overall it would be bad news to lose its second place status in China as a result of trying to adapt to our market. It's much more aggressive there pricing wise and the most powerful rule overall is "price wins". Dahua only got to where it is now by playing by Chinese market rules. For them to leave all of that behind for American market share, they would have to see the justifications in actual profitability and net income. Remember as well, they have a huge population there and that means that the market there alone is usually enough to get by.

MC
Marty Calhoun
Oct 26, 2016
IPVMU Certified

So if thats "enough to get by" does that mean the integrators in the US are "second fiddle"? and will be treated as such? At one time Hikvision was unknown also. I am not sure what you mean it sounds like we are great in China so we really dont care if the US market works or not so integrators get on board with us and if we decide to pull the plug 'oh well' we have China.

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 27, 2016
Independent

Well, it is business self-preservation we're talking about here. Expansion is nice, but it is a gamble. If I were a business owner and tried to expand my business to new markets (imagine trying to take Canon/Milestone/Axis into China), I'd be hard pressed to lose my base in my home country, especially if I'm not sure if I can rough it out there in the wild.

Basically, Dahua can't jeopardize its strength in China to gain ground here. Think about it from the perspective of a company that has a lot to lose and currently isn't in first place in their home country as it is. They're fighting the 500lb state sponsored gorilla that is Hikvision and it has an advantage overseas as well. They both cannot afford to let Hikvision wipe them out in China, nor can they let Hikvision gain the international market unchecked and fill its warchest even more. As it is, Hikvision is hurting all traditional non-Chinese manufacturers in a big way and basically turning it into China market 2.0. What do you expect Dahua to do in this instance?

In order to create the price obfuscation that traditionally a part of the industry that isn't China, they'd have to start in China in the first place. Do you think that would work in China at all when price is the driving factor?

Sure, they'll try and take care of the American and International markets the best they can with product innovations and support, but when it comes to reversing the price war (which I hate to death), I doubt Dahua is in a position where they can afford to do so. They don't have government money to keep them afloat.

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Sean Nelson
Oct 26, 2016
Nelly's Security

You have alot of passion about what you do and I admire that but I think your fighting a losing battle. In my experience, Dahua doesnt give a crap about recommendations or things they need to improve on. They are the most un-humilative company i have ever seen. I hope Im wrong, I wont hold my breath, but I would love to see you prove me wrong. Please let me know if thats the case. It will blow my mind.

RS
Robert Shih
Oct 27, 2016
Independent

Yeah, we had an interesting email exchange a while ago, you and I. I'm still chugging along and hoping to gain ground. I got to play around with a lot more stuff and suffice to say, I see a lot of potential. As long as our Dahua rep and I keep getting along, I think we might see the giant budge a little.

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Undisclosed #1
Oct 27, 2016
IPVMU Certified

They are the most un-humilative company I have ever seen.

You have them scrambling for their dictionary in Hangzhou:

"He said we are the most... what? Spell it."

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Sean Nelson
Oct 27, 2016
Nelly's Security

not even sure if thats a word, but you catch my drift. Google Translate may have some trouble.

U
Undisclosed #1
Oct 27, 2016
IPVMU Certified

How do you explain this then? :)

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