Subscriber Discussion

Should I Pay Overtime For Weekend Work Or Get Them To Take Off During The Week?

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Ari Erenthal
Dec 13, 2016

Saw this on Facebook, wanted to know what our community thought.

If you have an industrial customer that needs work done when the plant is down and the only days that they are down is Saturday and Sunday, do you schedule guys off a day or two during the week and pay straight time for the weekend work or do you charge the customer overtime for the Saturday and Sunday work?

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Harrison Mitchell
Dec 13, 2016

One thing to keep in mind, Sunday is the start of a new work week, so the OT wouldn't carry over to Sunday.

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Ari Erenthal
Dec 13, 2016

True, but the OP clarified that it would be a major project, so that they'd be working Saturdays and Sundays for multiple weeks.

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Kevin Bennett
Mar 20, 2017

That depends on the company's formal pay period, and perhaps on applicable state/local laws as well.  For instance, our pay "week" runs from Wednesday through Tuesday.

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Ethan Ace
Dec 13, 2016

I am not an employment lawyer (IANAEL) but I was under the impression work week had more to do with payroll period than calendar week. We switched from Sunday-Saturday at my first job to Monday-Sunday. I'm pretty sure I know of other companies who did the same.

Personally, I'd have these employees shift their work week and take off during Monday-Friday to compensate. I think if you're going to have multiple techs work a weird schedule, the best and fairest way to do so is sit down and talk to them. They may have input on what days would work best for their new effective "weekend", and you can reach a consensus.

I worked one project at said first job where we worked three 12 hour shifts and a four hour shift, from Sunday night til Wednesday night, then had the rest of the week off. I very occasionally was asked to run a service call if it was something only I could do, but mainly they respected our really non-standard week.

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Undisclosed Manufacturer #4
Mar 14, 2017

So on your basis of simply re-defining a Technicians working week, should we be re-defining the Schooldays of his Kids so the important family time is achieved, or should he be allowed to attend school with them during the off days during the week? 

Likewise should the technicians Church of Choice should also be requested to move the Services to meet the employers changing workday week?

Just charge the customer and pay the operatives and let them make the decision to work overtime weekends or not, if works that tight, then you need to be discussing the situation with employees and come to a consensus of opinion so you all benefit, after all a Single Volunteer is worth 10 Press Ganged Men!

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
Dec 13, 2016

Even Per any law , you must have a agreement in place with the employees, even changing the days off.

Details are very important and in writing so no misunderstanding

If in usa, or most states law's apply. and documentation apply's as well.

Mostly its about agreements and expectation s with employees.

You dont want to go back and pay thru the courts or ruin a company moral with bad decisions.

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Undisclosed #2
Dec 13, 2016
IPVMU Certified

I'd say charge the customer something extra for after hours time regardless of whether the employee was getting OT or not.

For two reasons,

1) If a tech works on more than one client in a given week, how would you determine which hours and which client the OT would be billed to?

2) IMHO, techs don't like to work weekends. Definitely not at straight time, and sometimes not even at time and a half. So you need to charge some non-trivial amount to encourage clients to request after hours work for special circumstances only.

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Jon Dillabaugh
Dec 14, 2016
Pro Focus LLC

If the customer needs special accommodations, they should be willing to pay accordingly.

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James Brightman
Dec 14, 2016

Depends on what market you are in. If there is plenty of work to go around and you force them to work the weekends (when their friends/family are home) and take days off when there is nobody to hang out with, they will most likely go find somewhere else to work. If the company is in a good financial state, why not reward them for working weekends? Wouldn't you want to be compensated a little extra if you were having to skip family time to be at work? Besides, if you pay them 1.5 or even 2 times the pay your production should also go up.

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JH
John Honovich
Dec 14, 2016
IPVM

James, welcome, thanks for a good first comment!

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Luis Carmona
Dec 14, 2016
Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

Integrator employers feel customers should pay an extra fee and employees feel they should get overtime, but what a customer is willing to do is a different thing. Unless your in a small and limited area, most customers will find someone who will not charge them extra and you'll have to shift days off to help keep costs in line and be competitive, 9.5 times out of 10. Especially if you are line item'ing everything and that extra labor cost becomes apparent.

You have more flexibility and it's easier to charge for the extra logistics when it is a much larger job or the customer is in a very rural area and is already used to have to paying extra labor costs.

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Jon Dillabaugh
Dec 14, 2016
Pro Focus LLC

Well, I don't see shorting employees as the answer to any problem. If the client is that unreasonable to pay a shift premium, then they should find a way to accommodate normal business hours.

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Luis Carmona
Dec 14, 2016
Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

How are you shorting them? They work 40 hours, they get paid 40 hours.

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Jon Dillabaugh
Dec 14, 2016
Pro Focus LLC

Because there are normal business hours and then there are after hours. This clearly would be outside of a normal 40 hour work week. One where some extra pay to make up for the time missed with family and such would go a long way. It's just the honorable thing to do. It the type of thing you do for valued employees that you would like to retain. It's the kind of thing, as an end user, you may find honorable and agreeable at the same time. Something that cements a trust in an integrator that respects both sides of the deal. He meets your demands of non-standard working hours, but at the same time is fair to his valued staff. Values like that build long lasting relationships.

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Luis Carmona
Dec 14, 2016
Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

I agree with those ideals, but how often do they really work out? I'd like to see another poll, "How often are you able to charge more for off hours new installs, or the customer goes somewhere else?"

Now keep in mind, I'm talking new Installs. Service is another matter.

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Jon Dillabaugh
Dec 14, 2016
Pro Focus LLC

I don't know how to say this without sounding high and mighty, but I've yet to regret sticking to my moral compass.

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Undisclosed #2
Dec 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

I've yet to regret sticking to my moral compass.

What are you guys using for a MMC? We have had good luck in the field with the unit below. Its auto-ranging and self-calibrating. You can't go wrong with this Fluke!

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Brian Rhodes
Dec 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

Visual pun score: 9/10

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Michael Miller
Dec 14, 2016

This falls under weekend or after hours work for us. The customer gets charged more and tech gets paid more. Most service business I know charge more for weekend work.

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Luis Carmona
Dec 14, 2016
Geutebruck USA • IPVMU Certified

Are you talking Service, a new installation or expansion, or both?

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Michael Miller
Dec 14, 2016

Both

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Keefe Lovgren
Dec 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

pay ot to your employee(s)... charge your customer ot... if they are asking for work to be done during non-typical business hours they most likely know they will be paying ot for that to happen...

the only way i can see that your customer would not pay ot would be if you have an agreement that states set wages and doesn't indicate the hours or indicates 24 hour availability...

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Undisclosed #3
Dec 14, 2016

If you are a Union shop one must follow the Union regulations. Perhaps in Podunk Idaho this would be a different conversation.

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Mark Bottomley
Dec 15, 2016

To me, the fairest thing is to ask the employee. Some would prefer the time off, others would prefer the money. If you are not bound by unions and can work within the local labor laws, employees would likely appreciate the flexibility. Given that, any employee may change there preferences based on their own situation during the year e.g. more money before/after Christmas and more time around Christmas.

I understand this may make scheduling and support a little more difficult, but morale cannot be underestimated.

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Undisclosed #5
Mar 14, 2017

For service work, I don't ever see a scenario where we wouldn't charge and pay OT for weekend work. 

For project work, I view it a little differently. I neither know nor care what union regulations say, but unless we are talking a project that is over 6+ months, I would hope that my employees would see the big picture. I would ask that they shift their schedule to still get 40 hours, and then I would be open with the client about paying a passthrough bonus to my employees that would be less than OT, but still something to provide an incentive for disrupting their lives a little bit. To me, that provides a partnership with the client that shows you're trying to keep costs down for them, but also still take care of employees.

 

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Sam Eskew
Mar 14, 2017

We face this often, and our policy is flexible. We usually charge an "off hours" rate, but sometimes cannot for one reason or another. Fortunately, our technicians are flexible. We have travel jobs that span over a weekend, and when access to the facility is allowed off hours, our guys prefer to continue to work to shorten the overall time away from home.

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Armando Perez
Mar 20, 2017
Hoosier Security and Security Owners Group • IPVMU Certified

We pay time and a half on weekends. IF they go into overtime, we pay double time. Customer pays more.

Part of how we keep really good technicians is being respectful of their home time.

There are places to save money, doing so at the expense of your people is the wrong choice. Customer wants weekend work? customer pays more if they want the better technicians who dont HAVE to work weekends.

 

That said, do not screw yourself just because your people deserve to be paid. IT goes both ways. Ensure you are charging enough to cover the added expense and the inevitable overage of hours by staying on top of change orders and such.

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