Subscriber Discussion

Redundant Hikvision NVR?

David Westberry

•Aug 14, 2014

IPVMU Certified

So a client has a home IP surveilance system (Hikvision) and they have concerns about the NVR being stolen, damaged etc. They have asked for a redundant solution so they will have a backup of the video. In a traditional analog system we would use looping outs or Ts and split the video to two recorders. IP doesnt work like that so I am curious what others would do in this situation.

Some ideas:

NAS storage elswhere in the house, maybe make this the only storage

VMS to record on a dedicated PC elsewhere in the house

Thanks,

Summary

[Official Hikvision Response]

You have two options- use a NAS or a second NVR (if non-PoE NVR). The cameras support multiple connections so record directly to the NAS or second NVR directly. Hik Cloud is not an option. It is not available in US and currently is only accesses uSD recording.

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Alex K

•Aug 14, 2014

Look at Hikvision new cloud service....

They MAY have cloud storage feature as not sure where video is getting stored

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Daniel S-T

•Aug 15, 2014

Why can't you just put a second NVR on the network, and have the cameras set up to record on there as well? Have the second NVR located in a different area.

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Alex K

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Daniel S-T

Because HIK camera plug directly to HIK NVR
and setup as separate subnet

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Alex K

Are you saying that a multi-streaming HIK camera cannot be setup to multi-stream to two HIK NVR's? What about one NVR and one NAS?

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Ethan Ace

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Rukmini Wilson

When you use NVRs with PoE output, they typically create a separate network on their internal switch, which is not routed through to the other Ethernet port. We talked about it in our Q-See test. You can connect cameras to a separate switch and connect them via the main port, but then you're negating the benefit of the built in switch.

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Ethan Ace

You can connect cameras to a separate switch and connect them via the main port, but then you're negating the benefit of the built in switch

Ok, what if you conncted POE port 16 of NVR1 to the uplink port of NVR2? Turn off DHCP on NVR2 and configure its network to match NVR1? Lose a port. :(

Of course, even if it works you still have the NVR1 switch as a single point of failure. This net disk option provides some redundancy for data, but relies even more on nvr working. Would be good if the main issue is theft, though.

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David Oleksy

•Jun 07, 2015

In reply to Ethan Ace

Even with the cameras plugged into the NVR integrated PoE switch you still can record on another NVR that is not connected to the same switch. The secondary NVR can pull video via RTSP URLs from the primary NVR using a custom RTSP protocol. This way, you also avoid the possibility of other devices changing the camera settings. If the primary NVR is disabled then you do stop recording. Try positioning the NVRs so it's the secondary that gets taken/smashed if possible.

Stream Path: /Streaming/channels/<channel_number><stream_number>

The stream_number must be two digits such as 01 for main stream and 02 for sub stream.

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David Westberry

•Aug 15, 2014

IPVMU Certified

Thank you for the responses.

So there is not a problem with multiple NVRs capturing and recording the stream from the camera?

The networking portion of connecting them is not a problem.

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to David Westberry

I'm of the opinion that it may be possible, provided that you don't mind wasting a POE port (on the side with all the cameras) to connect the hubs, and that the cameras can be setup for multi-streaming.

Be aware that my opinion is the weakest of anyone that has posted in the thread, since I have never used any Hik-ahua integrated hub product directly. Hik could easily be doing something with the ports that would screw it up. So maybe Alex or Ethan will comment, otherwise you would need to test.

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Alex K

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Rukmini Wilson

I am sure it's possible
very often I connect my Laptop in POE port
to setup cameras
In his case just plug NAS
and setup cameras

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David Westberry

•Aug 15, 2014

IPVMU Certified

In reply to Alex K

The question or problem I have is that the Hik cameras offer two streams: Main and Sub. The current NVR is already using these. Can another device also capture and use these streams simultaneously? I figured this would cause an issue and dont currently have two recorders to attempt with right now.

Thanks again.

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to David Westberry

No, not without multicasting, which would be (if even supported by both cameras and NVRs) probably not worth the hassle. Are the two streams configured with the same quality? Does the primary NVR need to record/use both?

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(1)

David Westberry

•Aug 15, 2014

IPVMU Certified

In reply to Rukmini Wilson

It uses the lower res sub stream for web and mobile streams. Client uses mobile devices to view. I thought that it was a problem. Looks like some type of remote storage is going to be the easiest solution.

I do appreciate the input.

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to David Westberry

Yes, I agree. NAS/Net Disk seems the best.*

*For the record though it does look like at least a few Hik cameras do support UDP multi-casting of streams. IMHO, that's the closest metaphoric equavalent to an analog 'T' of there is. One thing you could try even with one NVR, if you were curious, would be to set up a camera with a multicast address and then using a poe injector, plug it into the non-poe port of the hik switch. Then try adding it in using its multicast address. Unless you have something better to do all day. :)

Multicasting Surveillance Tutorial

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Ethan Ace

•Aug 15, 2014

In reply to Rukmini Wilson

You absolutely can send the same stream to more than one recorder via unicast. Cameras in the office here are recorded by the building owner, who gives us access to them as well. In addition to their Genetec system, I'm recording one camera in two other VMSes right now while testing. No multicasting is involved.

The real issue with sending a stream to multiple VMSes/NVRs is how each handles stream settings. Some will simply take what's set on the camera. Others (Milestone and Genetec, especially) will push settings to the camera. So if you have an IP camera set to 720p 10 FPS, for example, and you've set it that way via web interface, then connect it to Genetec which is set to 720p30, the framerate will change on the camera as well, impacting anyone else who may be using that stream. It gets real interesting if you have multiple VMSes connected and they all try to push settings...

If you're using two Hikvision NVRs, though, and make sure that you configure them both the same, chances are adding the camera to both will work fine. I don't recommend this when we're talking enterprise systems with super high uptime requirements and multiple VMSes, but in this case you will probably be okay.

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Rukmini Wilson

•Aug 16, 2014

Nice save Ethan! Yes agree, you can send the same video stream (main,sub) to multiple concurrent destinations via unicast. Though to be clear, from an IP perspective (wireshark) these would all be seperate unicast network streams with distinct endpoints, and each one would add some load and therefore eventually have some finite capacity, whereas multicasting would have no such limitation.

But since the number of concurrent connections to a given stream is typically > 5, having just 2 concurrent connections to 2 streams should be well within spec. So I recant and agree with Ethan.

If your client is really concerned about redundancy the two NVR setup maybe better than adding a NAS, since then there will be some downtime in case of failure, but not in the case of dual NVRs. Also with two NVRs (that are both physically accessible) its easier for the client to verify that the data is going to both systems, than with a NAS.

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Bob Germain

•Aug 18, 2014

[Official Hikvision Response]

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David Westberry

•Aug 18, 2014

IPVMU Certified

In reply to Bob Germain

Thank you Bob. Most appreciated.

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