NVR/VMS Recommendations For 12 Bosch/Axis 4K Cameras?
I'm in need of recommendations for a recording/video management solution. We have 4 Bosch Dinion 8000 cameras (12MP) at a commercial site and plan to add eight additional cameras (4K) in the near future. Having had a terrible experience with Bosch's DIVAR NVR, my hope is to find a reliable unit and software with more intuitive setup.
Wish List:
- Straightforward setup
- Compatible w/existing Bosch cameras and anticipated Axis (or other 4k) cameras
- 4+ TB of storage
- Basic analytics a plus
- Easy off-site management (web, iOS, Android) for no more than 3 users
- Total NVR/software cost in ~$2500 neighborhood
Is such an animal out there? Any and all feedback appreciated--thanks.
Barry What are you client machine specs for this project?
Thanks for reply. I'm new to this, so please bear with me.
We were previously relying on the Bosch DIVAR as all-in-one package--hardware with Windows 2008 server and fully licensed VMS. With return of DIVAR, we don't have a client machine, just a Cisco SC300-28PP switch waiting for a new appliance.
That said, we do have a nearby Dell XPS 8700 workstation (i5 3.2GHz, 12GB RAM, Windows 10 64-bit) that could itself be enlisted for this or upgraded to a machine with needed specs.
You are definitely going to want a high-end client computer if you plan to have that many 4K cameras. Normally it's not recommended to use your NVR/Server as a client computer.
Whatever VMS solution you go with make sure you check the client computer requirements for 4K cameras. You will want to make sure you client computers meet these requirements or you are going to have a bad experience.
That should be fine for recording if you simply added storage, internal or external. But, if you also need to to be a client station as well, you likely will need more CPU power (i7 quad or more) and dedicated graphics card(s), if it doesn't already have one or it is insufficient for 4K playback.
Don't forget a 4K capable display to utilize all that 4K video.
Using that Dell should help you meet your budget. If you need a graphics card, look for the best nVidia based card you can fit in the budget, with the GTX XX70 (970 or 1070) or XX80 (980 or 1080) series chipset. Don't settle for below the XX70 series, as these won't have enough speed to playback 4K smoothly.
To add to Jon's video card comment... if you do go that way, pay attention to how much video memory is on the card AND how much of it the VMS itself will use.
In our lab testing, some VMSs video card support is still 32 bit and will not use more than 2G on a card. The GPUZ tool will help you see this.
Regarding the use of a 4K monitor.
1)be sure to go physically big. A 27 in 4K monitor is useless...but a 60+ inch one is (depending on how far away it is from the user).
2) I have seen in lab testing on VMSs that some will see the expanded pixel count and end up doing more computing to service the larger space. This will use up more CPU resource. Resource Monitor is your friend to see this effect.
Full Disclosure - I work for Digital Watchdog
Barry,
I found the Bosch Dinion Ultra 8000 on our DW Spectrum - supported devices list, which means that some users have successfully used DW Specrtrum with this camera.
I have seen some other posts in the discussion section here on IPVM that have indicated that the setup is both intuitive and straightforward. Others have been in your shoes before a shared their experience - eos Blows Away The Competition
Not sure what analytics you are looking for but our Smart Search is pretty cool. Also, our Generic Event allows DW Spectrum to receive any third party event via HTTP if you find a analytic you like.
Our DW-BJCUBE4T may in fact be that animal.
That's a tight budget, but you could meet your goal with a Dell server running DW Spectrum. That's what I would sell, anyways.
One word of advice though, you are going to need way more than 4TB for twelve 4K cams. At least if you want more than a few days retention. I know you said 4+, but just wanted to stress that 4TB shouldn't be your floor.
Thanks, Jon. So is the thinking that the upgraded computer is the appliance (instead of an NVR), providing general server and storage functions, with DW Spectrum acting as the security-specific piece to make sense of things?
well with the exceptions of analytics you could buy the Samsung/Hanwha XRN-2011 NVR. for about $2300 plus more for extra storage it comes with every thing you asked for except analytics.
Plus Samsung/Hanwha 4K cameras are cheaper and just as good for the price. plus the NVR's are ONVIF compatible so even if you go with Bosch, AXIS, Panasonic, Sony etc, cameras they will work with it
Eddie--Just wanted to thank you for suggesting Hanwha. It's pushed me in a new direction of research that looks promising. We are looking at upping our budget a bit and pairing one of their 16TB NVR's with DW Spectrum.
Barry - for the missing analytics, you can run camio.com/box/vm on your Dell XPS 8700 to analyze the video from the Hanwha NVR.Full disclosure, I'm CEO of Camio. Since basic analysis doesn't require 4K, you can store the 4K on the NVR while analyzing a lower resolution stream using the NVR's RTSP URL like:
rtsp://{{username}}:{{password}}@{{ip_address}}:{{port}}/ch{{channel}}/{{stream}}
If you wanted, you could purchase a Cube from DW loaded with Spectrum, comes with 8 licenses right now. Add 4 more licenses and an extra HDD and you've got your box for about 2,500 fully licensed.
I'm a backline support manager at Milestone
I don't know the cost (I'm just a techie) but you could go with a Milestone Husky appliance, or of that's not your cuppa, but you still need "ready to fly" hardware, we have hw partners like Dell, HP, Seneca, BCDVideo and more who offer ready to use servers (https://www.milestonesys.com/community/business-partner-tools/partner-add-ons/?fp=&fst=Server&fr=region_North%20America&ffs=)
Other an LPR as an add-on, the software does not currently have analytics built in, but we support a wide range of edge-analytics from both Axis and Bosch, so you could potentially make use of them which eliminates compute requirement on the appliance/server itself. I use a HikVision camera at home to monitor the entry and use the onboard intrusion zone analytic rather than motion detection to trigger recording and push notifications for example.
Remote configuration/management would only be possible via remote access like TeamViewer or similar unless you landed on the XProtect Advanced platform (XProtect Expert, XProtect Corporate, or Husky M50/500A).
Joshua, can I get your e-mail? I'd like to discuss a Milestone related issue that I think you may be able to help us with.
Hi Andrew, my email is jh@milestonesys.com, but it would be best if you went through the normal technical support channels. Under normal circumstances, as the Americas backline support manager, my responsibility is to make sure our team is able to effectively handle escalated cases and provide guidance to our frontline teams.
I'm also about to head out of the office to go rescue my wife from the top of the Portland west hills where she lost her chains in the snow and is now stuck in the middle of our "snowpocalypse"...
If you've already been through support and the outcome wasn't what you were looking for, feel free to message me and I'll see if I can get you back on the rails. Otherwise you might try our support team first @ +1-503-350-1100 or support@milestonesys.com. If you're a registered reseller or an existing customer with Care Premium you should get through. There is no one in our phone queue at present, and only one call in the "customer service" queue which is where you'll land if you don't know your partner ID.
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