Subscriber Discussion

Looking For Information On One Year Of Video Storage

JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018

A local factory needs a 25 (ip) Camera System, but they want one full year of Video Storage.

This place manufacturers food products that have 7-8 months of shelf life, so they want to keep an eye on the stored product for the entire year.

Is this feasible using H.265 compression with an 8 Hard Drive System? Or can we use E-sata? How about setting the NVR to disable video overwrite and installing removable drives, like a SATA drive caddy?

Perhaps I need to use 2 x 16 Channel recorders and have one recorder store for the usual 30-60 days and the other recorder for the extended storage?

I need to know my options before making suggestions.

 

Thoughts?

john

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MM
Michael Miller
•Jun 21, 2018

Is this system going to record 24/7 or motion detection? 

Do you have a manufacturer in mind for this project?  I would recommend checking out if they have a storage calculator that you can use to come up the storage requirements for this project.  

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JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Michael Miller

Motion detect.   But after calculating the estimated hard drive storage, it appears

this will be a very expensive project.   I'm going to revisit the customer and convince him to reduce the storage requirements and put the money elsewhere, such as buying a new car!

Thanks for the input!

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MM
Michael Miller
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to John Silis

That doesn't seem like the best sales pitch. 

This is very doable with the right hardware and knowledge.

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JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Michael Miller

True, anything is doable if a blank check is presented. But first I need to make him understand there's a huge difference in storage requirements between standard NTSC analog and megapixel ip.  He has a 16 channel 480 fps Geovision system at another location that gets 3 months of recording with 4 TB of disk.   

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
•Jun 21, 2018

Years ago I had to calculate a 365 day storage system for 60 cameras at 24/7 D1 (that’s all there was at the time) 30IPS.   They turned chickens into chicken pieces and needed to view all processes for contamination.

The proper calculator AND knowing overhead, because you don’t get 8TB from an 8TB hard drive. 

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Avatar
Sean Patton
•Jun 21, 2018

As the other responses reflected, we'll need a little bit more information about the specifications of the cameras. Primarily the recording resolution(s), frame rate(s), and recording scheme (motion only, continuous, continuous boost quality on motion).

H265 can help, but really significantly when there are long stretches of video with little or no motion. Constant continuous motion (which could be possible in a manufacturing plant) might result in less impressive savings over H264.

Setting NVRs to disable video overwrite is available in some systems, you will need to check for that feature with the manufacturer.

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JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Sean Patton

I'm going to revisit the customer to see where cuts can be made.  We don't need 30 fps

and motion detect is preferred.  But after calculating nearly 200 TB of disk, this will

be a very expensive project.

Thanks for the input!

U
Undisclosed #4
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to John Silis

Not really

have a look

Storinator XL60

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MM
Michael Miller
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Undisclosed #4

Yea these work well for projects with long retention requirements. 

UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #2
•Jun 21, 2018

Check out the veracity coldstore  I believe it can allow for drives to be removed for archival and the drives are not all spinning so that extends the lifespan as well. 

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Avatar
Daniel S-T
•Jun 21, 2018

I mean a quick calculation using Exacq's storage calculator (I just use it because it's easy), shows you'd need close to 300TB of Storage to store 365 days worth of video. I used 25 cameras of an undecided manufacturer, 1080p resolution, H.264, 15 FPS, 24 hours of recording and a medium scene activity. 720p would be around 220 TB of storage. 

BCD's Storage Calculator puts it at 650TB at 1080P, 15FPS, 24 hours a day and H.264. Just over 500TB for H.265.


I don't think this is a simple NVR type set up, if they want a years worth. I feel like you're going to need RAID's, and a few of them to negate any data loss from bad drives, I guess it depends how quickly they want to access recordings from 134 days ago or what ever.

 

 

 

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JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Daniel S-T

Thanks for the numbers!  Looks like I need to visit the customer and find some alternatives.

U
Undisclosed #3
•Jun 21, 2018

Look at something that supports smart codec, dynamic frame rate, and H.265. You will definitely want RAID configuration and factor this into your storage requirement.

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Avatar
Jon Dillabaugh
•Jun 21, 2018
Pro Focus LLC

That level of storage is likely going to be above $100k for beginners. Ask them if they need full frame rate for archives, or if they would settle for lower frame rates for video older than XX days. 

If you can get them to settle on say 1 FPS for video older than 90 days, you could drastically reduce your storage needs. 

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U
Undisclosed #3
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Jon Dillabaugh

You'll be in the 150-200TB. $500 per Terabyte? Might consider cloud storage at those costs...assuming you have access to the bandwidth. (future IPVM analysis?)

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Avatar
Jon Dillabaugh
•Jun 21, 2018
Pro Focus LLC
In reply to Undisclosed #3

Others had it closer to 500-600TB, so that was what I was working with. I quickly looked at Dell and saw about $50k per NAS fully loaded and figured he would need two. 

MM
Michael Miller
•Jun 21, 2018
In reply to Jon Dillabaugh

If you know what your doing you can get the storage for this project between 25-50k easy.

Avatar
Jon Dillabaugh
•Jun 21, 2018
Pro Focus LLC
In reply to Michael Miller

Good to know. Never had such a retention requirement. 

JS
John Silis
•Jun 21, 2018

Thanks to everyone for your input.

I got the info I need and will proceed accordingly.

Avatar
Scott Bradford
•Jun 25, 2018
IPVMU Certified

I looked into something like this for a food manufacturing company as well.  Ask them if they need full frame rate for the long term video. You could do something pretty simple like Video Grooming with Milestone. Record the first 30-90 days of full res video at 25 FPS and then drop it to 5-10 fps for days 91-365. If you have an accident or food outbreak, you'll probably know about it within the first 90 days. The 91-365 day video is just a back up CYA. 

 

Also, does the plant operate 24-7-365? If they are only M-F 8a-6p then you get to drop off the nights and weekend video

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
•Jun 25, 2018
In reply to Scott Bradford

The issue I was asked to work on (many years ago) involved a processor who was being asked by the food chain to make sure items were not added during processing. 

Without trying to be graphic, I was told a whole chicken enters the process and formed pieces exit it with little human involvement. 

Therefore they wanted the fastest frame rate available which was 30 per second at the time. 

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