How Do You Talk About Politics In Your Office?

JH
John Honovich
Nov 11, 2016
IPVM

Just ran across this article: Boss says employees who agree with Trump's rhetoric should resign

So how do you talk about politics in your office?

At IPVM, I try to avoid it.

U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 11, 2016
IPVMU Certified

The CEO of Grubhub, an online food delivery service, sent a company wide email Wednesday suggesting employees who agree with President-elect Donald Trump’s behaviors and his campaign rhetoric should resign.

“If you do not agree with this statement then please reply to this email with your resignation because you have no place here,” wrote Matt Maloney, Co-Founder of Grubhub.

Ok, there is no freedom of speech in the workplace per se, but no freedom of thought?

Perhaps "Don't ask, don't tell" might be a better solution.

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JH
John Honovich
Nov 11, 2016
IPVM

So this case seems extreme and this guy, unsurprisingly, is getting a lot of heat for it.

I would genuinely like to hear how workplaces in the security industry handle this. Anyone?

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Nov 11, 2016

Definitely not like that article... that's just hostile. I may talk with like minded co-workers for a brief moment in hushed tones from time to time. I am in the midwest and do not have the same beliefs as many of my midwestern peers and subordinates. I do not want to offend them or enrage them, though they may not always believe the same. Political beliefs and religion are two areas I do everything within my power not discuss at work as it never ends well. When prompted I either remain silent or succumb to peer pressure and profess beliefs similar to those being spouted by whomever is talking, then remain silent or change the subject.

The executive team is likewise respectful. If politics are spoken of it is generally behind closed doors.

The only time I feel it is appropriate to discuss politics at work is when it pertains to work related matters. For example, if you do work internationally it's perfectly acceptable to discuss TPP, NAFTA, etc. I feel it is acceptable if not be framed in such a way that it is against a specific person/candidate, political party, news station, or similar.

Ranting and reposting clickbait is what Facebook is for.

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U
Undisclosed #8
Nov 13, 2016

"Political beliefs and religion are two areas I do everything within my power not discuss at work as it never ends well. When prompted I either remain silent or succumb to peer pressure and profess beliefs similar to those being spouted by whomever is talking, then remain silent or change the subject."

Say what?!

I (and most everyone else who's posted in this string) agree with the first part of your statement.... but you then say that when you are specifically asked, you lie and tell someone with differing beliefs that you agree with them?

That is unbelievable to me.... I can not fathom the logic behind that approach at all.

Who can ever believe anything you say if you would do that?

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U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 13, 2016
IPVMU Certified

I believe he will agree with you...

Now how about them Cubbies ;)

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UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #6
Nov 13, 2016

#notmyWorldSerieswinner

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U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

#notmyWorldSerieswinner

Because they failed to score more total runs?

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Nov 14, 2016

How do you know it is a "he"?

U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

How do you know its a he?

I don't, but to avoid being awkward, I alternate between pronouns in such situations, starting with 'he' :)

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Nov 14, 2016

Fair question. If in a group of camouflage wearing hunters who just spent the last 30 minutes talking about "Lying Hillary" and watching Fox News at work surround me and ask my belief on the topic I will absolutely take the path of least resistance to move on from the conversation. I would not walk through a black lives matter protest wearing a Make America Great Again hat either. Sometimes a lie is necessary to defuse a situation and politics are easy to work around with lies (our politicians do it all the time). I prefer to let my record stand on who would believe me.

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U
Undisclosed #8
Nov 14, 2016

UI2, you sound like a reasonable and intelligent person.... I am not here to say otherwise (as I do not know you, and you write in coherent sentences).

I just can not fathom doing that myself under any penalty less than death.

And I don't think yours is a logical position either. The truth always comes out.... it's a saying and shit.

It may be a temporarily more comfortable position - I will grant you that - but as with all lies, the risk to your personal credibility is far too great. (imo)

What if 2 weeks down the road you go out drinking with your office buddies and someone finds that election button in your glove compartment, eh? Then maybe they start digging a little deeper, and under the car manual they find your hat bearing the slogan of that candidate you said you hated, agreeing with them way back when? eh?

What then?

I don't think lying is ever the correct answer. period.

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Nov 14, 2016

I believe my credibility would stand on the positions I more firmly believe in, which pertain to work and not politics. While work is affected by politics my opinion on items that pertain to our industry is spoken loudly and unlikely to succumb to peer pressure.

I would say we derailed this thread enough, agree?

U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

...but as with all lies, the risk to your personal credibility is far too great.

Yes...

I am even beginning to doubt whether he actually lies about politics in the first place ;)

JH
John Honovich
Nov 14, 2016
IPVM

I just can not fathom doing that myself under any penalty less than death.

Then you obviously do not care about getting ahead in a corporation...

I, too, would not want to be in that position, ergo why I don't work for a big corporation. However, many people are in that situation, for whatever reason. Given the intolerance (often on both sides), if the people in power in your company are clearly pro one side of the other, if you are not on the same, you are forced to lie or hurt your corporate advancement.

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U
Undisclosed #8
Nov 14, 2016

"if the people in power in your company are clearly pro one side of the other, if you are not on the same, you are forced to lie or hurt your corporate advancement."

I absolutely disagree with this.

First of all, the practice of penalizing an employee for their political views is not legal and should be called out.

But even if you think that 'calling this out' would jeopardize your employment, you can always decline to participate in these types of discussions rather than feeling that you need to lie.

JH
John Honovich
Nov 14, 2016
IPVM

First of all, the practice of penalizing an employee for their political views is not legal and should be called out.

Good luck. Try to be the pro-Trump guy in Silicon Valley or the pro-Clinton person at a gun manufacturer...

you can always decline to participate in these types of discussions rather than feeling that you need to lie.

Yes, like this:

That [Clinton | Trump] sure is a piece of **** and should go to jail!

Dear management, I respectfully decline to participate in this discussion.

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U
Undisclosed #8
Nov 14, 2016

Yes - that is exactly right.

If you find yourself in a position of precariousness (whether true or perceived) because your beliefs don't tailor to managements, then state from the beginning that you do not participate in political discussions and you can avoid this quagmire all together.

If you start out with this position (and maintain it on both sides) - then you remove yourself from the position of weakness that your employer (by their illegal actions) has attempted to place you in.

Sometimes you can't fight the man - you are right about that. Even someone like me who is hardwired to fight the man can understand that fighting doesn't always produce the best results....but that doesn't mean you can't work hard to avoid the man in situations like this one - if simply to avoid having to lie.

U
Undisclosed #10
Nov 14, 2016

A story, not about political discussions, but the other topic that shouldn't be forced at work: religion.

When I started a job in my 20s, on one of the first sit down lunches I had with the general manager of the company (not my boss, but a boss), he literally said, "Let's talk about Jesus" and looked directly at me -- I didn't realize until after that the other guy at lunch with us (a new hire) was a pastor. I kind of chuckled and said, "Yeah, I like Jesus well enough." but he pressed it.

So as a 20 something trying to get ahead, what goes through your mind is NOT, "NO I MUST BE TRUE TO MY PRINCIPLES AND TELL HIM I DON'T ENGAGE IN THESE DISCUSSIONS" when you're sitting there wondering if you're going to be passed over for advancement for not being christian enough or liberal enough or republican enough or whatever. I personally hedged it as best I could without lying, but I don't blame anyone who outright lies.

Maybe it's not legal to penalize employees for their views, but you tell me how many junior employees in my position are going to quit when the job market ain't great (and it was way better then) and then go through the process of suing the company. The answer is nearly nil and I don't see that changing.

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U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

Boss: "Let's talk about Jesus"
Employee: "My take? Nice guy. Old school. Talented and knowledgeable, but sometimes doesn't take direction well. Also, can be a little sloppy."
Boss: "Really??"
Employee: "Yeah, but who am I to say? By the way I think he prefers 'Hay-soos'. Good hire, though."

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Ari Erenthal
Nov 14, 2016

Yeah, the Jesus conversation is always awkward.

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KL
Keefe Lovgren
Nov 14, 2016
IPVMU Certified

i get it... but i don't think many others do...

Meet the Parents comes to mind right now...

U
Undisclosed #8
Nov 14, 2016

I voted this Informative.

I understand that if you live and breath that sometimes situations such as these occur - and you find yourself with no apparently good options.

My meta-point is not that "I MUST BE TRUE TO MY PRINCIPLES AND TELL HIM I DON'T ENGAGE IN THESE DISCUSSIONS"

but rather, that there is no real upside to engaging in these discussions - beyond the temporary satiation of some senior level bullies ego - so it is better to avoid them when at all possible and refuse to engage in them if not.

Let's be straight - these kinds of power tactics are classic bullying. And in power structures such as these, you are probably right - you can not win.

And if you can not win, then the only option is not to engage.

U
Undisclosed #9
Nov 14, 2016

Stereotype much?

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Avatar
Josh Hendricks
Nov 11, 2016
Milestone Systems

Politics and religion are topics best avoided at work and at the pub.

As long as an employee exemplifies your company values in their daily work, their political views are irrelevant.

We make a few comments here and there but mostly try to avoid it. Being employed by what I perceive to be a more liberal leaning organisation, I don't want to risk others feeling alienated just because they like one candidate more than the other. Especially this year when we weren't given great choices to begin with.

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #3
Nov 11, 2016

Politicians are just puppets of the rich. I always talk about politics as an outsider which I am. Noone should except any good from a higher power, do your best for the company that is paying for your time, for yourself and your community/family, and avoid all those morally insane people who have a little bit of interest in any political group.

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UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #4
Nov 11, 2016

There are few, if any, positive things that can come from discussing politics at work. However, there are a lot of negative things that can result. It's best to be avoided.

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UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #5
Nov 11, 2016

We don't talk about it at the office - politics (like religion) is too divisive a subject and opinions often turn aggressive.

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UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #6
Nov 11, 2016

At our company, HR has been sending us memos asking us to limit political expression in the office, with a new memo every couple of months. It hasn't helped enough. We have a large group of people who were extremely active volunteers for one of the campaigns, and another large group of people who were extremely active volunteers for another one of the campaigns. Those people clashed a lot.

At least it meant I got to see the inside of both campaign's headquarters on Facebook and WhatsApp on Election Night. That was pretty cool.

As for me, I asked my direct-reports not to discuss politics at all, and I avoided discussing politics at work. Even in my private life, I tried to remain at the very least respectful and polite. I'm a little proud of the fact that only one person unfriended me on Facebook despite the fact that I have friends all over the political spectrum.

My advice: you can express your opinions respectfully and politely, while being respectful and polite towards people with whom you disagree, or you can be a schmuck. The choice is yours, but don't be surprised if no one wants to work with a schmuck.

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JH
John Honovich
Nov 11, 2016
IPVM
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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Nov 14, 2016

That's just ridiculous. Silicon Valley seems to be its own bubble.

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Michael Budalich
Nov 11, 2016
Genetec

I don't ever do this. What benefit do you stand to gain from talking about politics in your office? Serious question.

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U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 11, 2016
IPVMU Certified

Would like to hear from someone at Genetec Corporate. Must be a little politics discussed there....

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Ricardo Souza
Nov 11, 2016
Motorola Solutions • IPVMU Certified

Just some chit-chat here and there but always avoiding long and serious talks.

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Robert Baxter
Nov 11, 2016

We avoid talking about Canadian politics, however, we all seem to enjoy talking about US politics.

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UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #7
Nov 12, 2016

Fox has followed up with another article about the inevitable backlash from Trump supporters.

The company is already feeling the financial repercussions of an internal email the CEO sent to employees Wednesday, with company shares falling 5 percent in the last 24 hours.

He will learn from this: keep politics out of the office, and out of business.

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Keith Neilson
Nov 12, 2016

Talking and discussing is fine, normal, acceptable and should be encouraged BUT if you want to discuss / debate you have to accept other peoples point of view even if you don't agree, or especially if you don't agree. We have our problems here with the Brexit debate, and USA has its Presidential debate, as long as it is legal, and both are, you have to accept it even if you don't agree. It is attitudes that stifle debate that cause the problems.

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Michael Budalich
Nov 12, 2016
Genetec

There is absolutely no way I would ever discuss politics in the office. You're inviting debate and by nature debates can get heated and cause division in the work place. While I understand your point of view, I would never in my life discuss them in the work place. Nothing good will come out of political discussions in the office.

I prefer sports. It's much less divisive and less stressful to talk about.

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Keith Neilson
Nov 12, 2016

See your point, and i suppose i should have added "with most people its fine" however on Sports i live near Liverpool in England and i certainly know that discussing football (soccer) is far more dangerous than any politics, or religion.

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UE
Undisclosed End User #12
Nov 15, 2016

Soccer is Politics in Europe, Keith!

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Keith Neilson
Nov 15, 2016

And Religion Amen.

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KL
Keefe Lovgren
Nov 12, 2016
IPVMU Certified

freely and openly...

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U
Undisclosed #1
Nov 13, 2016
IPVMU Certified

carry

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Keith Neilson
Nov 14, 2016

Is the problem that we have forgotten, or never learned, how to debate freely. Everyone has the right to a point of view and even if i disagree i respect their opinion. If we never talk about these matters we will never learn, we just need to do it in a civilised respectful way. I do agree that it can and does cause problems, but believe that is because we are just not used to discussing things in a civilised way, we have forgotten how to do it.

i remember the saying, and forgive the paraphrase, "for evil to triumph all it needs is for good men (people) to do nothing" and not debating (in a civilised manner) will mean good people staying silent.

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Keith Neilson
Nov 14, 2016

Should have also added the Qt (again forgive the paraphrase)

"i disagree absolutely with what you are saying, but i will defend to my death your right to say it"

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UE
Undisclosed End User #11
Nov 14, 2016

A Left-Coaster here... We talk a little about political happenings, but avoid commentary for the most part. Have witnessed some progressives (aka liberals) show personal political views in the form of anti-Trump rhetoric. It's concerning how friggen traumatized some are from Trump's victory. The Trump supporters have been pretty quiet about his win so not to make the liberals cry.

IMHO, Liberals have always seemed to overshare their superior "progressive" views. It's like the Jesus conversation, some people are compelled to over share their values with others.

I think the trick at work is to keep the political conversations at the level of not showing personal commentary. No really one cares and I'm not being paid to convert anyone.

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