Subscriber Discussion

How Do I Know The Optimal Bitrate For H.264 For My Cameras (Primarily In UHD) ?

TH
Truman HW
•Jan 15, 2018

At what bitrate do I

1. start losing noticeable quality with H.264s bitrate?
2. decrease the life-span by making the SoC/Processor over-work?
3. what would you guys typically regard as optimal? 

I can increase the duration of my storage... but I'd rather buy more hard drives than burn out cameras... or get crappy images in playback. 

How do I know the optimal bitrate for the cameras I have...so I don't over-work them by making them work harder trying to compress data to a higher degree all day -- when these things don't (to my knowledge) have fans in them...

I don't want to burn the cameras out
I don't want to waste HDD space
I don't want to needlessly undermine the video quality

Should  I post the models of camera here?


OBVIOUSLY, I'd love to use H.265 -- which all my cameras have, but Milestone has merely casually forgotten to work on any of the units I have.

It's a super cool and incredibly manageably system, but!

I have 2 identical hikvision cameras; it finds one but not the other?

I've chosen "Manually select" With the IP address entered, UN/PW, Port, and it's same model selected.... finds temporarily - and then CANNOT find the camera? Hours and hours of trying? But I can log in to it from any computer's browser? 

CANNOT find my bosch Fisheye 70122 , thought it's on the supported list!?  Just bizarre stuff.... 

Am I the only one frothing at the bit to get H.265 drivers for the equipment I own in the Milestone ecosystem ... I cannot WAIT for this bandwidth savings. Am I alone here? 

I'll wait a while and see.  

JH
John Honovich
•Jan 15, 2018
IPVM

You don't want to set or find the 'optimal' bitrate. You want to use VBR and let the camera pick it, see CBR vs VBR vs MBR - Surveillance Streaming. Also, the major issue in terms of degrading quality is the compression level, see: Video Quality / Compression Tutorial. Understand what the manufacturer is defaulting to, see: IP Camera Manufacturer Compression Comparison and you can appropriately adjust the compression level to your liking.

I have never heard anyone say this ("decrease the life-span by making the SoC/Processor over-work?") is a practical issue.

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TH
Truman HW
•Jan 16, 2018
In reply to John Honovich

I own a computer store...so when I think of a camera sending a raw signal that has to be compressed (along with any 'smart features' that are invoked) I assume things will be made hot, and eventually there will be failure. Which also makes me confused as to why they don't put fans in these things. :) 

Okay, again, I have overlooked stating important considerations...

I use VBR by default.
Most of my cameras are 4k.

Most of them are also H.265, but from browsers, to Milestone, you already know how slow the roll out is. 


What I mean is -- (I presume obviously) the thing that will matter the most with surveillance is precisely those events that are harder to record; more movement, more people, fast motion, etc. -- all of which will substantially increase the complexity of the content.

So my point should have actually been stated as; "With 4k cameras and using H.264, what bit-rate is sufficient for the camera to capture complex situations?"

(And I'm sure there are problems with [that] question I'm not thinking of... but its closer to what is relevant I hope. :)

JH
John Honovich
•Jan 16, 2018
IPVM
In reply to Truman HW

"With 4k cameras and using H.264, what bit-rate is sufficient for the camera to capture complex situations?"

It depends on too many factors to give a single number or even tight range. Not only compression level, frame rate but the use of smart codecs, the complexity of the scene itself, etc. Related, see: Advanced Camera Bandwidth Test Results

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Mike Dotson
•Jan 15, 2018
Formerly of Seneca • IPVMU Certified

When I see a misbehaving network connection, let alone the VMS not finding it, it may mean there is another device configured at the same IP.

The cam vendors own 'find and setup' tool helps here since they look for MAC addresses of their own cams to work with.

Another tool I like to use is 'IPScan' which will tell me what the system can see out on all its network connections.

The BW question should really be 'what is the minimum level of detail I can tolerate' to provide what is needed to determine whatever actions are being looked for.  This will help you set the compression level on the cam.

Combine this with the slowest FPS needed for detection to minimize BW to a practical setting for each individual camera.

Be sure to check out the tutorials that John mentioned to be able to understand all these effects.

 

U
Undisclosed #1
•Jan 16, 2018
IPVMU Certified

OBVIOUSLY, I'd love to use H.265 -- which all my cameras have, but Milestone has merely casually forgotten to work on any of the units I have.

All your Dahua’s are good to go, right?

How Did Dahua Get So MANY H.265 Supported Devices On Milestone? They Have A 3rd For Just Them.

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