Subscriber Discussion

When Is Fire Caulk Required Between Floors?

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
Oct 31, 2017

2 story leasing office with a big open area. Kind of like an atrium. Stairs that go upstairs are wide open. No fire doors anywhere.

 

Is fire caulking still required between floors?

 

We ran Cat5 from 1st Floor to 2nd Floor, and now it failed. The 2nd issue is the GC is giving us no time to correct and is billing the client to do the caulking today.

 

Should we have caulked?

 

Should we be allowed to fix?

 

 

Avatar
Brian Rhodes
Oct 31, 2017
IPVMU Certified

The NEC is pretty plain on requiring this on any penetration in firewalls, and even a plain gyp board/sheetrocked wall may carry a firewall rating.

The 2005 edition of the NEC (Article 300.21 Spread of Fire or Products of Combustion) states: “Openings around cable penetrations through fire-resistant rated walls, partitions, floors or ceilings shall be fire stopped using approved methods to maintain the fire-resistance rating.”

If the GC has been told to fix it by an AHJ, compliance is mandatory, so you can't challenge the GC if they are complying.

We ran Cat5 from 1st Floor to 2nd Floor, and now it failed

Does this mean Failed Inspection? Who inspected it?

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Oct 31, 2017

Imitation is more than flattery.  Did others caulk?

Is the ceiling a plenum used for air transfer?  Are the areas supported by different air handlers?

Of course, local codes apply. 

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
Oct 31, 2017

We were never given real design plans, just a powerpoint of where the cameras and drops should be.

 

The building was torched, so it was gutted to the studs, and that is when we did our rough in. Brian seems pretty clear on the code but on the other hand, we did not penetrate any fire rated items. We drilled through 2x4's, 2x6's and OSB I believe was the flooring material. There was no sheetrock. I can't remember all the details but I know none of the electrical that was there was caulked, but that was months ago. If it had been caulked, I would have told the guys to caulk ours.

 

As far as the GC complying, I think that is a stretch. What if electrical fails, does the GC rework the panel? Plumbing? I think if an item fails due to a particular vendors fault, that vendor should have the opportunity to correct.

 

What really ticks me off is this is a small 3,000 sg ft building that has been under remodel for 6 months, and they are just getting permits for rough-in and no drywall has gone in. Every time I try to get an update it's like pulling teeth.

 

6 months to demo and rough in, yet he won't give me 2 days to come caulk. I don't think there is an appropriate emoji here...

 

 

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Avatar
Brian Rhodes
Oct 31, 2017
IPVMU Certified

Are you being billed for the caulking work?

(1)
U
Undisclosed #3
Oct 31, 2017
IPVMU Certified

We ran Cat5 from 1st Floor to 2nd Floor, and now it failed. The 2nd issue is the GC is giving us no time to correct and is billing the client to do the caulking today.

...but I know none of the electrical that was there was caulked...

Maybe the electrical failed inspection for the same reason, and he’s just having the electricians fix both at the same time for efficiency.

Is it a significant amount of remediation that it makes a real financial impact to you who does the work?

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
Oct 31, 2017

Yes the GC wants to bill the client, which in turn we could be liable for. In the grand scheme no, it's not a lot. But I do have a tech that lives 10 minutes away so it would have been easy for him to do.

 

It was more of the point, hey it failed now we are going to charge you to fix. They emailed me and told me it failed, then said they would fix.No mention of charging the client. It should only be a few holes in the same area. 30 minutes work max. Then I get a call today saying they are billing the client $300. That pissed me off.

 

As it turns out, the owner is paying the GC directly and I was told to relax. So I am keeping my mouth shut. I have a habit of arguing stuff to my detriment...

 

 

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JE
Jim Elder
Nov 01, 2017
IPVMU Certified

Presumably there is an architect or "approved" drawing that was used to obtain a building permit. ALWAYS check the construction drawings which will tell you which walls are fire rated. Usually, these include egress corridors, stairs, some electrical closets, but don't guess. Check the plan and your penetrations must match the rating of that partition/floor. This would include materials and methods used.

UM
Undisclosed Manufacturer #4
Nov 01, 2017

"The building was torched..."  Sounds like everyone is sensitive to any fire issues.  Maybe the AHJ and/or the owner feels overly concerned about the fire stop caulking?

 

Avatar
Christopher Freeman
Nov 01, 2017

yes

cff

 

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