Dahua - Reliable Source Needed

Greetings:

I have lurked here for a few months, maybe there is someone who can assist me. I am looking to purchase about seven Dahua IP cameras, a mix of ourdoor PTZ, fixed and indoor. I have the Dahua part numbers from the 10_2014 catalog ready to order.

The total order volume is about 2800 USD not including shipping. These prices are from two Alibaba "gold" suppliers, both of which advertise their participation in trade assurance, similar to an escrow.

The one supplier I was working with who confirmed their participation in trade assurance backed out of the deal after I received an invoice and wanted to be paid directly. The other supplier refused trade assurance from the beginning, however she said she could order the Dahua branded cameras.

My first impression is that if I am a manufacturer, and I put my name on it, its more likely to get the first quality product, a "generic" product can be resold to a distributor and if there are any quality issues it becomes their problem. That is why I am skeptical of the generics.

I am sort of the "unofficial" IT person at work, we use these cameras to provide weather info to our pilots, if we had to pay US prices they would be prohibitive as its about double the grey market cost. I am rather computer literate, and am suppoprting the cameras we have now, and do not need someone to guide me through the setup. I can flash English firmware, no problem, as long as I can get access to the file. I don't mind grey market so long as the product is the real item and not a counterfeit. Our need is immediate....I can wait three weeks though, for the order process.

I am aware of the changing position of Dahua on sales outside of China, but their product is getting to the US anyway.

CAN ANYONE help me and name a REPUTABLE distributor they have done business with in China? Or someone in the US who can just sell me the product(s) without having to support me? I see these on Newegg.com for about double the cost, even those resellers have poor feedback because of some counterfeits. I don't mind paypal for one, maybe two cameras but if am going to send 2800.00 USD directly some feedback on sources would be needed.

If you could be kind enough to provide contact info I would be grateful. I would even buy you a dinner (paypal) to say thanks.

Thank you


Which part#'s do you want?

We need: (2) DH-SD6C220S-HN (1) DH--SD63220S-HN (3) DH-IPC-HFW5200C (1) DH-IPC-HDB4200F-PT (1) IPC HDBW4200E
Additional mounting brackets: (3) PFA-120 (1) PFA-150 (2) PFA-151 (2) PFA-122
Thank you

What about buying them thru Amazon?

Hi, the part numbers are posted here. Who are you?

I'm Undisclosed 1, née A, but just 1 is fine. :)

I see some of the parts on Aliexpress, with their escrow deal. I have used them a few times, without a dispute, though sometimes the delivery dates got pushed a week or two out.

Are you open to using them?

Hi undisclosed 1:

I am open to Alibaba with trade assurance. They are more B to B than aliexpress (with a 1000 US minimum order for TA). However my trust with the one supplier with whom I attempted a deal with backed out of using trade assurance so I probably would not use them even if they recoinsidered....lack of trust, now. I don't want to post names (yet) but if you message me here I would be happy to privately disclose. Actually their invoice was for 2900 plus shipping (prob. 250.00 or so).

I suppose I could look at aliexpress but there is a lot more junk to crawl through. Could you drop a few supplier names?

Greg

Or someone in the US who can just sell me the product(s) without having to support me?

The only authorized U.S. source that I'm aware of is Automated Outlet.

Thanks for your reply. I have seen Automated Outlet's web page and they do not show the same part numbers.

No outdoor PTZ IR and PTZ (no IR) cameras for less than triple gray market. I don't mind gray market sources but some feedback on business with them before wiring 2800.00 or more is a must for me.

Any other suggestions?

Are you stuck on Dahua? You can get Hikvision (basicly the same price) very easy in the US.

Thanks for your reply. We have already done the research and find Dahua to be a better product, also since we have a couple now its best to stay with the same interface. I bought these gray market also, but sending a paypal for 500.00 is a lot less risky than 3000.00.

So yes, for the time being I'll stick with Dahua if possible.

Greg, will they let you paypal the $2800?

As a side note, you are the perfect case study for Dahua's channel challenges. I should pay you for showcasing this :)

Yes, one supplier was able to accept paypal for that amount. I might reconsider if I can get paypal to confirm some sort of buyer protection for an overseas merchant account. I could check the supplier's account with paypal (if they would share with me, probably unlikely) for any complaints of non-delivery or defective product.

The other supplier (who advertised trade assurance participation) backed out at the end and wanted a direct wire transfer. At least it was a business (appeared to be) account. Who knows?

Thanks for your comment.

"I might reconsider if I can get paypal to confirm some sort of buyer protection for an overseas merchant account."

My understanding and experience is that PayPal has buyer protection for every purchase. We had someone legitimately PayPal us ~$3,000 internationally for 10 seats in a course and PayPal refunded them their money even though the buyer did not request, simply because PayPal was concerned that the charge might be illegitimate. Call PayPal and ask them but my experience is that they are very strongly protective of buyers.

I forwarded this to Dahua. Not sure what if anything they can do but typically this is a source of frustration for them as they are trying to build separate channels.

Btw, one other legit Dahua option is FLIR who sells a lot of Dahua products OEMed at low prices in the US. That said, I am not sure if it as low as a Chinese alibaba reseller.

John:

Thanks! I have messaged Dahua on Globalsources (they have an "official" presence there, it seems) and have yet to receive a reply.

Greg

This also makes a great case study for the trials and pitfalls of DIY and how people can get themselves into trouble. Think of all the hours Greg has spent on this already, at a burdened labor rate and loss of productivity.

Greg still might end up ahead, depending on how much he saves here, how much he might buy in the future once this is set up versus what his hourly costs and total time expended are.

That said, this is a little risky for my tastes, including the likelihood that if something goes wrong, Dahua will refuse to support or replace it (i.e., what warranty).

There are very few distributors (besides automated outlet). I can tell you that not all of Dahua's inventory is available in the US. I do have a couple of numbers that might help you out... please have John pass along my information to you. I wish to remain anonymous for personal reasons.

[IPVM Note: Done]

The fact you are trying to get grey market items and not pay "usa" prices is part of the whole problem. Sorry, I understand budgets, but customers like you are destroying the market and killing US companies. Sorry but companies do need to make a profit, and there are many times reasons prices are higher here. Are you paying the import tariffs and duties on the grey market items?

Yes, channels are broken, but buy things the legit way and stop being part of the problem.

Undisclosed 3, or Dahua can make it easier to buy products legitimately in the US and make China products less easily obtainable / usable in the US.

"make China products less easily usable in the US." Hikvision is doing just that, or so I was told.

Related: Buying Hikvision Chinese Versions Vs USA Ones

Quote from Hikvision USA: "The [Chinese] Firmware is different and cannot be upgraded to USA GUI."

Yes it seems Hikvision is trying to make firmware changes difficult for the average user. Hex editing the firmware file to reveal the English GUI. At least according to one post. This sort of marketing based on where you live...less expensive in some countries, more expensive in others....for essentially the same product....is troubling to me. Similar to region coding dvds. It might be fairer to all if a manufacturer sold based on their production cost plus a fair markup. Not like "hey you are us buyer, you pay more" for the same item.

"This sort of marketing based on where you live...less expensive in some countries, more expensive in others....for essentially the same product....is troubling to me."

I see your point but I can also understand the point of the businesses. For example, IPVM charges a single global rate and we have members from 100+ countries. However, we probably could generate more total revenue and profits if we did regional price segmentation. $199 per year is effectively far more expensive in India than it is in the US, e.g. I mention India because that is the one country we get regular price complaints for IPVM. For us, it's not worth the headache administering this but I see the appeal for other companies.

Of course, the other segmentation approach is modifying products. That's basically what Hikvision is doing. Ok with Chinese interface? Lower price. Need an English interface? Higher price.

Interesting that you have a lock on something without having them in hands first :-) Anyway, I may able to bridge you directly with a sales guy works in Dahua China. Just FYI, it takes about 5 days for DHL to get the cameras from China to my office in east coast here.

Thank you, I am going to reply to the last two posts. Yes I do pay the import duties, they are imposed by US customs. I have no choice there.

Regarding people like me "killing the market" please hear me out.

You assume I am a business who can write off these costs to customers. I am assisting my work, who is not in the security business, in my down time to install a series of cameras at airport facilities we fly into. For general weather info. My work is for a Hospital and I don't want to mention their name here, sorry. I am very computer literate and do not need the value-added services offered by many resellers. I can, and do support these cameras myself.

If the only option was to pay 1200 for the very same camera which costs 500, then that's it, we can't do that. You have not lost me as a customer because at that price point, thats just not an option.

We should have the freedom.....and accept the risk....to source where we are able. I agree China prices are generally lower....and their quality is all over the map....so its important to find a reliable source.

I am sorry if you feel people like me are bad for business.....at the prices I have seen on the US side we could not do business.

Thanks for listening, I understand your position and I hope you understand mine.

If the only option was to pay 1200 for the very same camera which costs 500, then that's it, we can't do that. You have not lost me as a customer because at that price point, thats just not an option.

Unless you might buy a lesser model that you could afford, no?

My experience with the Dahua IP camera (one of two, the other, probably counterfeit, was junk) was excellent. Great build and trouble-free. Unfortunately, I can't contact that supplier any longer.

So here we are.

Thank you

I agree. Greg is not killing the market by looking for a lesser expensive product, the market is being killed by customers trading off reliability, quality and service for the cheap bottom line price. The irony being it sometimes cost them the same or more in the long run, and when they complain about "cost effective" products that are cheap. It's a lessening of standards, even if they don't want to admit it.

It's an arbitrage play. The main question is how big is the savings / profit relative to the risks involved (reliability, quality and service).

Dahua has made this attractive to play because of its broken channel model. Once, and if, Dahua can rectify that, the price gap should diminish and rationale buyers like Greg will find it less attractive to go grey market.

Louis:

While we are ready to deal now, I certainly accept a reasonable lead time, say 3 to 4 weeks?

Thank you

Louis: I'm listening. I am open to any source who can supply the legit product.

Thank you. We would like to find a supplier asap however after an invoice is paid for three weeks is fine.

Hi.

for both Dahua and Hikvision, don't buy the china targeted version. The camera may look the same but the chipset is different and the firmware cannot be updated.

we are a Singapore based distributor for Hikvision and Dahua. If u are keen can contact me and I will revert on pricing.

thanks

Matthew: I am open to any source who can obtain the legitimate product. I posted a list which appears earlier in this thread.

We can wait for the best option, I welcome your contact.

Thank you

Matthew please contact me stevemerrill@t-s-I-inc.com

So you are supporting a business that flies into many different airports but can't afford to pay 6000k for cameras? If you are just using these for weather why do you absolutely have to have Dahua and why do you need indoor models? This is a very strange post... There are many cameras you could get that would work great for your budget. Why not use those?

The indoor ones are for a different project.

The outdoor ones require IP 66 or 67, heaters for -30c, poe, onboard server for remote access, multi user logins. Some are ptz some fixed. All on the list are 2mp. Since we were fortunate last year to get a legit camera we want to stay with what has proven to be an excellent product. The build quality was good and it made it through our Winter with no downtime.

Thank you for your comment.

Greg, here is a list of active suppliers of Dahua branded product which Dahua would prefer you not use:

  • www.dahuawhosales.com
  • www.visiotech.es http://www.securityessentialscctv.com/
  • Security product supermarket (http://www.cctv-mall.com/)
  • Amazon (http://www.amazon.com)
  • eBay (http://www.ebay.com)
  • Aliexpress (http://www.aliexpress.com)
  • Alibaba (http://www.1688.com/)
  • Hangzhou Quan'an Technology Co., Ltd (http://www.hzqakj.com)
  • BONDWELL (http://www.bondwellcctv.net)
  • Zysecurity (http://www.zysecurity.com/)
  • Shenzhen Dayi Technology Co., Ltd (http://www.dayitech.cn/en-us/home.aspx)
  • Networkcamera wholesale (http://www.networkcamerawholesale.com/)
  • Bulwark Tech Ltd (www.dahuawholesale.com)
  • SINTRA BALTIC (www.sintrabaltic.eu)
  • Sunivision Technology Development Co., Ltd (www.sunivision.com)
  • Dahua Security (http://dahuasecurity.co.nz/)
  • HUABEN TECHNOLOGY LIMITED (www.huabencctv.com)
  • Yahoo (http://hsrd.yahoo.com/)
  • PROVIDEO CO., LTD (www.provideo.com.tw)
  • Wei-Yah Technology Co., Ltd •http://anny6225.tpy888.cn/

Just so you don't use one by accident. ;)

If you are not rushed, why not order a dome or two first from a place like this who accepts pay-pal? That way if you get it when they promise AND it checks out, you might place a larger order. And with paypal you can get your money back from fraud as long as you make your claim in a timely manner.

I dont blame you for trying to save money and I dont think your communist for buying from China, LOL. You are looking out for yourself and trying to make the best bang for your buck.

My question is, are you really saving money in the long run or is it actually costing you more? I think as an end user, you are taking a risk on a fairly decent sized job. Not a huge job but big enough where you should think twice about what you are getting yourself into.

I have to disclaim that Im the owner of a company that sells Dahua products, but I think it would be more wise for you to buy from a USA based supplier than from China, even if it wasnt from us. The following 2 questions explain why:

#1) What if you need tech support? What if you need to pick up the phone and call someone for help. I know you said you are fairly tech savvy which is great, but we have long time IT professionals that call us everyday for tech support on these products. If you dont know your way around an interface or the specific features about products, especially on specialty products such as PTZ's, it sure is nice to have the ability to call someone who does know that stuff.

#2) What happens when your camera goes dead and you need to get it warrantied? Have you figured in the shipping and export costs it would be to send a camera back to China, especially a big one such as a PTZ? And the import costs to receive the repaired or replaced unit back into the USA? Have you considered that that company may not even respond to you when you ask to get a warranty taken care of? This is a small chinese company we are talking about. Also, how long is the whole process of getting this replaced or repaired? Weeks? Months?

Is this money coming out of your own pocket or your company's? Are you prepared to face the backlash from the money man if you find that you cant get the equipment up and running properly. Or worse, what happens if you have a defective products and you have to go to the money man and ask him for more money just to get the product repaired and its a complete crap shoot that the unit will be repaired at all, what happens if it gets lost in the Chinese logistics system?

I guess what Im saying is that its fairly risky endeavor if you ask me. There isnt anything wrong with taking a risk depending on how risk averse you are. My guess is that after you figure in shipping and import costs from China and all of the "oppurtunity costs", you really arent saving much money at all. You would probably be saving money buying from a US based supplier.

Sean: Thank you for getting back to me. I would like to ask you a question, which is probably best discussed in person and not on a public forum. You will recall I contacted you with a parts list a month ago. To your points: Nobody is listening to me. I am able to do my own tech support. Call me a geek if you want but I have been configuring computer systems since 1986. I have CCNA credentials and these cameras, well, are not that complicated. If I can't solve a problem, then its my risk and my loss. I accept the risk of failure of a unit, long term. If I receive the "real" product, and it is not DOA, and fails in 6 months, well, again, my risk, my loss. I would not bother to send it back. In that event, at current prices, I break even. I am very pleased with our last install, (PTZ), which made it through a very cold Winter with no problems. While I am willing to pay a reasonable premium to buy from a authorized US source, double or triple the real product cost is not acceptable. I do not consider a camera with crippled firmware, done for market differentiation, where a hexedit or two can restore the English menu, to be a different product. I will confess to not being familiar with the hardware differences, if any, for the Asian market, so in my quote requests I always require English firmware, or the "international" models which can be flashed. I am not an end-user, technically. Just because my main income is not derived from cameras does not mean I am not qualified to perform the work, I have done several installs and we are pleased with the results. Yes it would be nice to consult with someone, if that is needed I would rather just pay for your time. I have done that with other experts and will continue to do so. There is no backlash from our company because the (smaller) airports we serve are in rural areas and if we had to pay to have these installed, well, its just not going to happen. They are pleased to have the cameras because the airports we put them at do not have weather reporting. Thank you for your comments.

No problem Greg. If you assume and understand the risks and are okay with it, then I say by all means go for it.

Greg, you originally asked for either

  1. A U.S. based Dahua distributor that could sell cheap.
  2. A Chinese based Dahua distributor that you can trust.

I think that this is proving to be difficult because in the case of #1:

No U.S. based distributor can buy direct from Dahua (except perhaps A.O.). So you have at least one more layer of markup involved.

And in the case of #2:

No Chinese distributor selling into the U.S. is doing so with Dahua's approval, which means that anything could happen at anytime to their ability to supply product. Dahua might be able to cut them off or give them Chinese firmware, while they have your money in hand, leading to various excuses while they scramble or refund you or worse.

If you are set on getting the cheapest price at the lowest risk, I think that there is nothing to do then buy from someone on the Dahua blacklist above that also supports PayPal or other escrow mechanism. I saw several that offer such protection. The one that I showed above was from cctv-mall, who had a pre-ship price of $2,400 and took PayPal.

Even if ten members were to tell you XYZ distributor was reputable, I would not put my money at risk by not using escrow.

If you want some other examples of blacklisted Dahua dealers with the product you want and the escrow you need, let me know.

Edit: Also to be considered is trying to find the equivalent models from a large U.S. based OEM like FLIR, as John mentioned above, since presumably they could be buying direct from Dahua.

Chris:

I will admit I checked your links. Some were dead, but I did match up the screenshot of the shopping cart to cctv mall.

Thanks for the info and I appreciate the effort you made to post this. I am going to wait for another week to check on a lead from here, if not that might be a good option.

Facts, not promoting nor selling them.

The specs per Greg's list:

Louis, is there a specific point you are making here or are you just showing a description of the models or?

John,

Detail spec of the products.

In case if someone knows any legit dealers carry the same but OEM'd products under other brand.

No need to overthinking it. :-)

Looking at it for a bit last night, the problem seems to be with the PTZ and the vari-focal bullet. Both are too high end for many of the OEM's to carry.

Here is my 2 cents on the issue given:

While you might be able to technically support yourself and have plenty of working knowledge with networking and computers, you don't have as much working knowledge with Dahua part numbers and accessories. Trust me when I say that sometimes we run into incompatibilities with certain mounts or wall brackets. It's nice to have someone like Sean there for help.

The other major issue is it doesn't sound like you are in the importing business, so you are over your head there. If you were into importing electronics from China, you would find a Mfg rep there to be your advocate and work the deal from that side of the pond. But since you only are buying $2800 of stuff once, you won't find a suitor.

Basically, the very reason why this isn't working out for you is exactly why no one does it. Do you think you have some novel idea that sourcing from Ali is the golden goose? Most smaller integrators have tried (and failed) to do the very thing you are trying to do. These Ali vendors list every single part number in the catalog, but rarely have ever sold one single unit of some of the obscure part numbers. They certainly don't have inventory. I don't understand why you would place so much trust into that Ali vendor half way around the world instead of a great guy like Sean who actually has inventory, will support you personally, and speaks English, even if it is with an accent ;)

If this were my scenario and I couldn't afford the U.S. price of these given models, I would rethink my solution. You have your line drawn in the sand, but I'm sure there are ways to use other models or no PTZs. I challenge you to rethink that part.

Amen Jon.

This whole discussion seems like a staged dialog for undermining the sales channel (albeit far from ideal).

I don't understand why you would place so much trust into that Ali vendor half way around the world instead of a great guy like Sean...

$

That makes no sense to me. If money is as critical as you say, you wouldn't risk it so easily. You would buy from a reliable source to keep from risking it.

Also you say you want "real" Dahua product instead of OEM labeled, like Eyesurv or Flir, but who is to say that the China dealer isn't going to slap a Dahua logo on an OEM unit? You have absolutely ZERO control over what they sell you. At least with a U.S. OEM you have a reliable source that isn't motivated to scam you.

This whole scenario screams of alterior motives...

"This whole scenario screams of alterior motives..."

STOP. It's one thing to suggest alternatives. It's another thing to insinuate and attack a person who is obviously looking to buy products for his organization.

John,

"This whole scenario screams of alterior motives..." is hardly an attack.

Jon has given many valid points - one of which is that this is a very self-contridicting post. Almost everyone here knows the true cost of ownership is realized over a period of time and "savings" are relative to much more than up front cost. It is obvious this guy wants to find a place to specifically buy Dahua products through an unsupported channel - which in and of itself is curious at best.

This whole post seems like some kind of a setup of sorts - either to expose those willing to provide Dahua products through unsupported channels or something from IPVM to stir up thinking about the sales channel itself.

Somehow I've let myself get sucked into this - again! - Thanks alot IPVM... uggh!

"It is obvious this guy wants to"

It is obvious that certain integrators hate to see end users go around them, buy direct and do their own installs. If you want to play the 'ulterior motive' game, then fine, there you go.

As I have said throughout, I agree that there are downsides and risks of this approach, but there's zero reason to believe Greg has any 'ulterior motives'.

John,

"Obvious" was in response to your comment: "It's another thing to insinuate and attack a person who is (obviously) looking to buy products for his organization"

This is one of the weirdest posts I've seen on IPVM for sure. Nothing wrong with someone with a skillset utilizing it to "save" their company money. However, purchasing goods from questionable sources is another situation all together. He is saving his company money by not hiring an integrator which is fine - the problem is the actual purchase of the equipment - this wouldn't happen from an integrator anyway - just an authorized partner with goods that are backed up by the MFG.

It seems I stirred up quite the hornet's nest.

For all you "undisclosed" people who think I am trying to undermine your income....why don't you have the courage to put your name with your thoughts?.....

Due the nature of some of the most recent comments, I must counter. That being said, if John H wants to delete this entire discussion, I'm fine with that. Its turning into a bit of a mudfest. I found two or three contacts and I am thankful for that.


In reply to Jon:

Thank you for posting with your real name. I respect your opinion.

Jon: "sometimes we run into incompatibilities with certain mounts or wall brackets. It's nice to have someone like Sean there for help."

I agree. If I was looking for a turnkey solution, that is correct. You might ask Sean, whom I contacted over one month ago with specific part numbers.

Jon: "The other major issue is it doesn't sound like you are in the importing business, so you are over your head there".

Were you born speaking fluent English and with a complete career skill set? Yes its a challenge. No, I do not expect a mfr's rep to work with me an my smaller quantities. But I do find there are honest sellers, and less than honest, in the US, China or whereever you are.

"Basically, the very reason why this isn't working out for you is exactly why no one does it."

Who says it is not working out? Its a hassle, I agree, yes my time is worth something and I have already stated I would be willing to pay a reasonable markup for a reliable US source. Double or triple the price is not reasonable, especially since I assume full responsibility for support.

"Do you think you have some novel idea that sourcing from Ali is the golden goose?"

Of course not. My experience with their Trade Assurance program was a total failure. So no Ali for me.

"I don't understand why you would place so much trust into that Ali vendor half way around the world instead of a great guy like Sean who actually has inventory,""

Sean does not appear to have the inventory I want. He appears to be a nice guy. I have bought two cameras from Ali suppliers before, several more from US sources, the US cameras were no better than genuine product I did receive from China. Of couse the counterfeit one I received was poorly made.

"If this were my scenario and I couldn't afford the U.S. price of these given models, I would rethink my solution"

Spoken with your viewpoint, I am certain, of someone who is in the systems integration or resale business.

To Undisclosed:

"This whole discussion seems like a staged dialog for undermining the sales channel"

This is pure BS. Should I post the sales invoices from the source I do buy from?


To another Undisclosed:

"If money is as critical as you say, you wouldn't risk it so easily"

False logic. I would agree if I did not have the skills to support these projects. If I wanted to carelessly risk my money, I would have wired overseas money to the first supplier who responded.

"you say you want "real" Dahua product instead of OEM labeled" "who is to say that the China dealer isn't going to slap a Dahua logo on an OEM unit? You have absolutely ZERO control over what they sell you. At least with a U.S. OEM you have a reliable source that isn't motivated to scam you"

I agree. That is why I am doing my homework. I have found sometimes I am equally disappointed in the quality of tech products, whether I buy from a US source or from China.

"This whole scenario screams of alterior motives..."

Since you think that, please tell what they may be.............

In response to a post which just appeared as I am writing this:

Yes, I do look at thia as a learning experience, I may, indeed pursue this as a part time career. There is no Dahua dristributor in our rural northern state, I have been providing IT consulting for a while and yes I probably use my experience with this for future projects.

**********I want to thank John H, Louis, Matthew and Chris. Your time and thoughts are appreciated. **************

My opinion, which will probably be countered:

The counterfeit market in IP cameras, and the US situation for genuine Dahua... reminds me much of software.....Many software packages are overpriced (my opinion) and there is a lot of piracy. Like the gray market for Dahua. You can buy an app from Apple or Google for 2 to 15 dollars, (often free if you don't mind ads, I would rather pay) and for the
most part, they are making huge money and there is little piracy.

I agree, the distribution of the Dahua brand is a mess.. They should stick to making cameras, set a fair markup, and quit trying to control their market by manipulating price and crippling firmware by market (if they do as Hik does).

If they want to have distributors, or integrators sell their product with value-added services, fine. I am sure they
discount for large quantities. Those people can resell at a higher price, bundles with their services. If someone like me is looking for the hardware and not the service, I should be able to buy at a lower price. Do you hire a chef to cook all your meals or eat at a restaurant seven days a week? Of course not, you go the to the grocery store. If this was done, whether you are buying in the US, in China, or wherever, the grey market incentive would be gone. The entire practice of market segmentation in today's global economy is simply wrong, from a buyer's standpoint.

Hi Greg,

Thought I would chime in with my first contribution to the IPVM site.

I am an integrator based in Australia. For over 12 months I have imported Dahua cameras & recorders regularly, typically $15K - $20K spend every couple of months. I do not import direct off Dahua but another company in China.

The experiance has been a real eye opener for me. nothing but positive. I receive extremely prompt responses to all and any of my queries using Skype. Being in basically the same time zone as China has been advantageous with Skype. Last week I requested a firmware update for a particular camera and recieved it within seconds of the request.

If I order a particular NVR in Australia and it is out of stock with my local supplier, I will have to wait at least 5 days for it to ship via road from another state.

My orders arrive within 3 days from China via air & I have full access to the full suite of DAHUA products and not just the limited Items my local suppliers provide.

So basically i enjoy lower prices & better service/support from my new friends in China. If I run out or need further stock I can source it locally.

Its a great setup but I am unfortunaltely loathe to share the name of the company I deal with given some of the above comments, I would hate for my current avenue to be shut down.

Not being a regular contributor, I could not find a private message function.

NOTICE: This comment has been moved to its own discussion: Buying Dahua Direct From China - Great Setup

Will anything change now that Seadan has been named as the exclusive Dahua distributor for Australia?

Greg,

What about your time? Does it have not value? Is this an altruistic attempt to save your company money? Or are you getting paid for all this effort? Is this information you plan on using in the future for other projects?

This whole post seems like some kind of a setup of sorts - either to expose those willing to provide Dahua products through unsupported channels or something from IPVM to stir up thinking about the sales channel itself.

But what's the motive exactly? Dahua surely has no problem finding unsupported vendors, if they want to. Their problem, depending if they really view it as a problem, is in China, not the U.S.

As for IPVM stirring things up, anything is possible I suppose, but this particular topic has been beat so far down I doubt there is much more to say about it:

This is a person who disclosed his name and linked to his organization's website. Then he asked for 5 different models and 4 different mounting brackets. And you think that is staged by IPVM? Absolutely not.

I wish I could have been clever enough to show how thin-skinned and tweaked certain integrators get that end users cut them out. But this thread is surely showing that.

And you think that is staged by IPVM?

Actually I am arguing just the opposite; aside from the reasons you mention, I'm saying there is no motive in any case.

Wow... how embarrassing. One person asks a simple question, states his reasons and everyone attacks as if he is going to make the difference in your paycheck by purchasing 7 cameras! He's simply trying to make his life (and other co-workers (i.e., pilots)) easier by being able to view the airport he flies in and out of. I understand where he is coming from... he doesn't have a real budget to purchase cameras so he's maximizing what he has and he gets attacked for wanting to make the best of his situation. The time and effort you guys put into making him look bad is pathetic.

Stick to the subject/topic here... if you can't help him then don't be so petty as to attach him to try and make yourselves look "better". In fact, do us a favor and hit the "unsubscribe" button and go away.

If he had it all figured out, he wouldn't have came here asking for advice/sources/help. It's obvious that finding a cheap, reliable, and honest dealer in China with inventory is a tough thing to find. My contention is that if there WERE a dealer like that, they probably aren't looking to sell to an end user $2800 worth of product at no margin with no hope for repeat business. Why would they? The only dealers that would take the time to even reply to that email would likely be someone who was trying to get over on the buyer in some way. They certainly won't use a risky payment method like PayPal or other escrow services. They couldn't run their scam otherwise.

And who's to say that the pricing he has seen on Ali is even legit pricing that these dealers are truly willing to sell at? They seem to be backing down from them. When you say two to three times the price of the "real" price, you are assuming that the Ali price is an honest price.

To the others defending his position of price sensitivity, if his budget is that low, how can you justify the cost of using a PTZ? Surely you don't need a PTZ to see if it is raining or not.

To those claiming I'm worried he is stealing business from me don't know me well. If an end user has the ability to do a self install, which seems obvious here, they don't need me. I would be wasting my time. I would rather spend my time on clients that need my services. In fact, I only come here to help people. So thinking my advice is for self gain is just wrong. He asked for advice and I gave mine. Simple

I wish you luck finding genuine Dahua at the super low prices you are looking for and don't get scammed or receive a DOA unit or get your product held in customs or any other number of obstacles.

Good luck!

He didn't have it all figured out... thats why he was here asking for help! And who cares if a dealer would have sold to him or not! Who cares if he can afford a PTZ or not! That wasn't the point of his posting! It doesn't matter what a dealer would have sold to him or not sold to him. Thats his problem, not yours!

He didn't ask for advice, he asked for trusted chinese vendors OR someone in the US to sell him the product within his budget.

CAN ANYONE help me and name a REPUTABLE distributor they have done business with in China? Or someone in the US who can just sell me the product(s) without having to support me? I see these on Newegg.com for about double the cost, even those resellers have poor feedback because of some counterfeits. I don't mind paypal for one, maybe two cameras but if am going to send 2800.00 USD directly some feedback on sources would be needed.

If you could be kind enough to provide contact info I would be grateful. I would even buy you a dinner (paypal) to say thanks.

This got blown way out of porportion for no reason whatsoever!

I have to admit I'm really surprised (and disappointed) by the responses to this thread. We all need help at times, I for one appreciate the information that is shared so generously most of the time. I really hope that this does not occur again.

FWIW - It would appear from following Greg's link that these 'airports' are more precisely 'heliports' at various Hospitals, which are utilized by a fully-staffed and fully-equipped medical helicopter operating 365 days a year.

This air ambulance has flown over 10,000 flights and saved over 1,000 lives.

However, it is a non-profit organization that runs normally runs a deficit from operations and therefore relies on continual fund raising to stay in the air.

So, yeah it seems it is an "altruistic attempt to save his company money" after all.

---------------------------

On a technical note I'm wondering if the PTZ's are ever used for spotting incoming aircraft? Since the helicopter might be coming from numerous and distant directions, a PTZ would be a natural choice for tracking.

Also, unlike most PTZ's that require dedicated operators to be effective, these might only need be manned during flight operations, making them much cheaper to operate than a normal PTZ deployment. Just a thought...

I agree with Margarita. I disagree with the route that Greg is taking. I think at the very least if he is going to DIY, he should at least go with a professional brand he can source in the US. Maybe he won't have the budget to get all the cameras he wants then, but will it cause a crash if it there are not enough cameras?

Regardless, I stated my viewpoint and left it at that. For eveyone who is arguing, ask yourselves, are you just paraphrasing the same thing you said already? Are you thinking you weren't made clear the first time, or are you just feeling compelled to respond to disgreements because you want to get the last word in? Too many times in forums is seems people respond repetitively not because they have something to add to what they previosuly said, but are just re-stating what they said because they have to get the last word in or they can't accept someone disagrees with them, and they think repeating themselves enough times will change a person's mind.

I'm not accusing anyone directly here, but I'm asking each and every person to take a moment and think.

Just curious, If cost savings was the most important driving factor, and cctv is not a normal job function, why did the OP pay $$$ for an IPVM membership? This is mostly a trade focused website and if money was as tight as was said, there are many free sites for end users out there and the money could have gone to equipment. Just seems confusing.

Enough of this.

I am not allowing any more criticism of the poster's request and such further comments will be immediately deleted. If you don't want to help or think he is wrong, go read another IPVM discussion.

Your hurting IPVM by making legitimate users feel unwelcome by asking legitimate questions.

Did you try IC Realtime?

1) He doesn't want OEM products

2) IC Realtime may be the highest cost of the Dahua OEM's

Update: I want to thank everyone for their comments. I think I hit a nerve and the experience has been interesting, to say the least. We recently concluded a fairly large order with a US supplier....not very easy to find but the wait was worth it.

Spent about 25% more than overseas prices however figuring not having to pay customs duty, and reduced shipping cost the difference was less than that....and it took only a week from placing the order to receive the cameras. And we received the real thing. We received a mix of logoed and OEM cameras so we could compare the differences, if any. There were none.

I continue to be impressed with the quality of Dahua's products....we received the real thing and hopefully we will do more business with this supplier.

Possibly my next post(s) will be on less contentious topics.

Greg

Greg, great! Thanks for the update and thanks for sharing this.

Are you aware that talked with Dahua US lately? They opened up an office over the summer and have hired different RSMs, so it appears they are going to make things easier for users to buy direct in the US.

Greg can you contact me I would also prefer a U.S. supplier. Dtevemerrill@t-s-i-inc.com

I know it is not in the US, but when I was at Ingram Micro Canada, we distributed Dahua (NOT OEM). I dont know if they still do, or if they ever opened the US market but it may be worth checking.