Subscriber Discussion

Why Do My Cameras And PoE Midspans Keep Getting Fried?

KJ
Kenny Johnson
Apr 06, 2017

Hello, we have a major issue on our hands.

At a roadside "rest area" we have axis ptz cameras with axis poe midspans.

In the last year we have had approx 7 cameras and 16 midspans killed by some type of electricity.

We had electricians go out... they say the poles are grounded and see no problem.

They tested the backup generator and see no problem.

They wanted me to ask if Axis equipment is especially sensitive to electricity. 

Any tips???  thanks!!!

UI
Undisclosed Integrator #1
Apr 06, 2017

Could be many items but I would investigate electrical surges, brownouts, etc.  Also, depending upon the generator maybe the cutover isn't smooth.  Anecdotally I have heard generators can take a while to start up though I have never seen this myself.  It may be that your devices are running on brownout level power until the generator fully transitions.

Do you have a UPS?  If not, you should really have a decent one out there.  UPS aren't just for backup power.  They condition the power as well.  At a site where I had a similar issue at a pole over and over again the minute I plugged in a UPS I could hear it flip back and forth between battery and source pass through with a faint alarm.  This was clearly poor current.  Aside from continuously replacing the batteries every year this "solved" the issue at... at least in terms of burnt out devices.

For the most part Axis equipment is not abnormally sensitive to electricity.  If you have specific models perhaps there is a trend to be spotted.  However, since your midspans are dying as well it seems unlikely to be the cameras.

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #2
Apr 06, 2017

Which model camera?

Most of the AXIS PTZs will also call for shielded cable in the install instructions - it is only recently that they have had grounding terminals etc on the camera body. I have several 'problem sites' where using properly connected shields has meant no more lost AXIS PTZs. 

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MC
Marty Calhoun
Apr 06, 2017
IPVMU Certified

Get rid of all copper (Cat5 or 6) that you possibly can and use Multi-Mode fiber. Its inexpensive to use and very easy to install. Cost of fiber is way, way down and if you have a trained fiber technician on board, well, you are good to go.....

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JL
Joe Lara
Apr 12, 2017

Would you run fiber all the way into the camera or do you need transceivers and copper to connect the camera?  Sounds like more points of failure to me.  I am looking for a solution like this for some long distance camera runs.

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Avatar
Jon Dillabaugh
Apr 06, 2017
Pro Focus LLC

Do you have any active UPS on each PoE injector? Do you have lightning arresting equipment on both ends, just after the midspan and just before the camera?

EP
Eddie Perry
Apr 06, 2017

do you have Surge protection and or a UPS?

if not I would recommend  it heavily for out site cameras on poles

the generator coming on has fried several of my PoE injectors and midspans. best fix every time was a $200 UPS. even if their is any problem that could harm the midspans, injectors, or cameras, the UPS will sacrifice itself before letting any surge destroy stuff down the line and that is a $200 cost (rare as most have reset buttons for things like that) which is way cheaper than an of the AXIS name brand Premium equipment you would have to replace.

In line cat5 and cat6 surge protectors would be the next Item I would invest in. anywhere from $10-$100 a piece they can save your cameras I use them any where I have Direct burial Cat5/6 in the ground that's not in conduit.

Fiber would be a good way to go for future installs if you can terminate fiber or have someone do it on the cheap for you. 

But this sounds like a job for a UPS and some surge protectors.

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #3
Apr 07, 2017

Do cheaper ($60-$100) UPS provide any sort of power conditioning or does that only occur in the more expensive electronic versions?

Avatar
Jon Dillabaugh
Apr 07, 2017
Pro Focus LLC

Active UPS start a little higher I think. Most sub $100 units are stand by, at least I've never seen active units that cheap.

Cyberpower has an active 850va that MSRPs for $150. You might get them for less than that, but probably not down to $100.

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #3
Apr 08, 2017

Thanks, I have never used an active UPS. Just curious if the cheap backup battery versions offered even minor conditioning. 

U
Undisclosed #4
Apr 09, 2017
IPVMU Certified

Thanks, I have never used an active UPS. 

In case you are researching them, I believe Jon is referring to "line-interactive" when he says "active" UPS technology.

As opposed to "standby/passive", which typically only offer surge protection.

 

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Avatar
Harrison Mitchell
Apr 07, 2017

We had a similar issue at a school parking lot and we eventually bought a device that monitored the electrical current and logged it. It was basically a smart power strip that would show you how much current went through and at what time. If you already know there are surges happening, it might not tell you much more than when or how much, but it could help you pinpoint the issue.

 

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U
Undisclosed #4
Apr 07, 2017
IPVMU Certified

Any post-mortem on the units indicating cause of failure?

Whose mid-span?  Are they passive?

GF
Gerald Fowler
Apr 08, 2017

Ya i have bunch of them at a site 60 watt ones always have reboot them every other week,pain in the butt.Keeps dropping connection couldn't get any headway from axis.I have similar units american dynamic poe fiber switch connect in same manner,no issues.

Avatar
Peter Pavlov
Apr 12, 2017

We have had similar issues in the past for pole mounted cameras and most of them were attributed to voltage surges. Unfortunately, the Axis midspans do not have good over voltage protection so we started using MeanWell hardened power supplies paired with TrendNet hardened POE injectors(part number TI-IG60). The MeanWell power supplies have excellent protection and we have not have any issues with them. 

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UI
Undisclosed Integrator #5
Apr 12, 2017

While all the above statements are true and should be considered, don't forget about temperature. If the POE mid-span devices are located outdoor, that could be an issue. I design a lot of outdoor systems and found that most outdoor rated cameras come with a POE mid-span that is only rated for indoor use. I always discard that mid-span and use a hardened POE or 24 VAC or whichever voltage type your camera can accept. Cold and heat are killers to electronic equipment.

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Avatar
Brian Hampton
Apr 12, 2017
IPVMU Certified

I've had good luck with Veracity's Outreach Max XT extenders. Although I did have one that blew up from a lightning strike but it didn't damage any equipment on either side.

CH
Corbin Hambrick
Apr 12, 2017

For Power and UPS go with SurgeX.  Pricey but worth it.

U
Undisclosed #6
Apr 12, 2017

I saw the exact same issue in many city and DOT installs. I'm working with the electric company in HI and they have confirmed that inconsistent under voltage is causing this. Added UPS and no more problems. You need to get a cleaner power source and problem should be solved. 

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