Avigilon Is Trying To Sell To Me Direct

Another integrator, in another region, forwarded us an email last month about a case where they say Avigilon sold to an end user, setting the end user up technically as a dealer.

I have forwarded your post to Avigilon for comment and will update if I receive.

Avigilon is a manufacturer and we build our cameras here in North America.

Btw, interesting that he is leading with the made in North America angle. I am curious if that is his personal pitch or if this is Avigilon policy to emphasize that upfront, especially with China / the race to the bottom.

There are multiple manufacturers that are going directly to end users from a sales/marketing perspective, and the more that I think about it, the less I have an issue with it. While I don't love it, at the end of the day these are businesses that have to sell to survive, and depending on the efforts of others to both build interest AND install the product is, largely, not a winning combination in today's environment. 

If I ever found out personally that they sold direct to an end user -- ANY end user -- I would immediately cut them from my offering, and they are one of my lead products. I did over a million dollars with them last year, so I don't say that lightly. But, that would be unforgivable to me, and would end the relationship immediately.

Talking to end users is one thing, and I don't feel like I can reasonably expect them to stop doing that. I would do the same thing. But selling to them is a totally different story.

I also have to say, I don't understand the title of this thread at all. Nothing about that email suggests that they were trying to actually sell you anything directly, they were just trying to showcase their product. I think someone has been reading Buzzfeed too much -- "YOU'LL NEVER BELIEVE WHAT THIS MANUFACTURER DID!" :)

Are you an integrator or end user?  Avigilon's model is to sell direct to integrators.  If you are an integrator this is completely normal. 

If they had emailed me and said, "We are looking to setup meetings for our integrators." I wouldn't have been so skeptical of this email. If it's their intention to set up meetings for integrators good for them and sign me up. If they want to compete with me (which is what this email sounds like), I'm not interested in dealing with them.

I hope to not upset anyone here. I am an end user from a large enterprise company.  Emails that come up like that in my inbox would be binned immediately cited as phishing and spam. If a company wants to get in the door, the way is through a trusted integrator or partner the end user is working with.  Or the end user would as the integrator for an introduction.  Mass publicity is just mail overload and smart users ignore this.

Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, either way, in my experience and from others, it's been helpful.  

Apparently happening in Cape town south Africa as well

I have to say I did not read anything in the post that seems to imply Avigilon attempting to sell direct to an end user.

Think of it like this- do Ford dealers get up in arms if Ford runs commercials and ads for their cars, even when Ford does not sell direct to consumers? No, Ford is generating interest in the product so people will go to dealers and buy cars.

Unlike Axis, whose reps will tell IT people working for end users to buy cameras from the likes of CDW and install it themselves.

I think its genius they are marketing towards end users, of course as long as they dont sell to them. Essentially, Avigilon is selling for the integrator. What more could you ask for?

There needs to be a distinction between "a manufacturer selling an end user" and "a manufacturer conducting a revenue generating transaction directly with an end user." 

Manufacturers in all industries for as as long as marketing has existed are trying to, "sell an end user." As noted earlier, Ford. Add McDonalds, Perdue, Exxon, Dupont, whoever manufactures Viagra and Cialis and a thousand others. 

While there are an increasing number of exceptions with the expansion of on-line transactions (largely commodities or niche boutique), these manufacturers (including Avigilon) all sell through their channels. You buy a Ford from a Ford dealer, not Ford the manufacturer. You buy chicken from a grocery store (food dealer) not Purdue the manufacturer, you by gas from a gas station (gas dealer) not Exxon the manufacturer, etc. 

A manufacturer that does not "sell" the end user on the value of their proposition, either real or perceived,  is doomed to mediocrity if not abject failure. 

As a manufacturer, I've never had a dealer say, "I don't want that business because you "sold the end user direct." 

Any manufacturers that want to call on end users and pass the lead on to us, just let me know. Well even pay commission ! :)

If they're just trying to earn business for integrators good for them. Although i would be curious to know how they would decide who to give the business to. I assume it's whichever integrator they like more. This is not like ford advertising, ford advertises and immediately directs you to the closest dealer, there was no indication in the email that a local integrator would be involved. This seems like a move to sell or explore selling direct to end users. I would not be surprised if in the coming years they started to subcontract electricians to pull cable for them and have their own people install the hardware. Is Avigilon letting their integrators know they're reaching out to portential clients to find new business for them? If their clients are ok with this than that's fine with me. Personally I have less interest in working with a company that does this. I don't want to compete with a manufacturer for business or whoever their favorite integrator is. I could be wrong about all of this and if I am, I'll happily admit it.

That email reads like it was Google Translated from Chinese...

They show up at our facility about once a year pushing their product on us, we let them buy us lunch and watch their demo. But always pass on the product.  They make it seem we would be buying direct from them. We even were going to set up a small live 1 month demo with a number of cameras in production last time they were here before we decided to stay with Genetec,  So yea, it seems like they sell direct, but I cant say for 100% certain, since we have never got past the flirting phase.  We are a  tribal government agency, so I don't know, they may be able to sell direct to us.  We can usually get in on all the federal gov pricing. 

Here is what I know:

1. Avigilon does hunt for sales with End User later to be funnelled through the Partner channel 

2. Avigilon does not sell to End Users, there must be a sophisticated Partner agreement in place on the account before a sale can be processed or the CRM does not allow the processing of the sale. At second stage the sale is examined and validated by the credit department for release.

The inside Sales Team at Avigilon often lacks communication with the RSM's , so there is duplicity at times and yes sometimes blind errors that cause issues with perception such as the story above. The main issue is internal communication.

Yes, what Avigilon has done/is doing is not just marketing to end users but actively getting in front of customers to "sell" their end to end solution, no integrator involvement.  

So in my strong opinion there happens to be two issues with this aggressive approach (the most I have yet to see).  

The first is that if they are successful in convincing the potential customer that Avigilon is the right and only choice, they tell that customer where they can purchase their products/solutions. But in my territory those Avigilon dealers are not quality competitors, some are really not even in the security business (Avigilon brought them on because they were weak and the larger integrators wouldn’t play ball early in their growth), if you do represent other VMS’s you are not typically recommended (they only recommend the ones that only sell Avigilon – of course).

The second issue is Avigilon only cares about Avigilon.  So every time we have been involved, it was multiple Avigilon “dealers” all bidding on the same thing.  Well you don’t need an MBA to know that this just results in lower profit, not where any company wants to be.  Avigilon is looking for integrators that just do what they are told as cheaply as possible – their goal is to just get their stuff sold/installed, period.  That integrator doesn’t need to build servers, estimate anything, engineer anything etc.  just be low, show up and install everything.

To the person that says he is both a Genetec and Avigilon dealer, I wonder how many Avigilon opportunities were brought to him after Avigilon brought him in on something and then he sold that customer Genetec?  Remember that Avigilon thinks (just like Genetec I imagine if they were being honest) that their solution is the best for every situation.  Also I have a strong inkling that their salespeople are under a ton of pressure to make their numbers.  If I was under that kind of pressure, I would be looking for the most docile systems integrators to bring leads, ones that wouldn't muck up my sales efforts.

Avigilon presence at trade shows brings inquiries from end users.   In our experience Avigilon has, provided demos to the end user and referred integrators they feel qualified to handle that customer. They have also invited us to the 1st or 2nd meeting with these end users. A lot of these inquiries have provided opportunities for us. Our relationship with sales and support has been very positive since getting on board with them in 2008.  I have had no problems with their methods of marketing to the end user, in turn it has provided more opportunities for dealers to be awarded projects.     

This thread is bait and hook in itself.

Was it just me, or did anyone else hear this inside your head?

Here is the thing and regardless of the brand the minute you decide to limit your opportunities, you limit the revenue you are able to generate.

From the beginning of time you could have the Electrolux salesman coming to your door competing with the Kirby Saleman ( yes shows my age) each of them have a pitch..... why because it is the nature of competitive sales. It has been the method used since time immemorial and nothing wrong with that it is healthy competition and may the best product win.

Do ethics play a role? Of course they do, my personal experience has been filled with wonderful people and experiences that have never left me questioning business practices. In short the system is not setup to serve their customers in this manner and every Partner is scrutinized not only by the RSM but many levels up from that until it reaches credit check time.

We all know and we are all guilty of sending a bad email here and there or maybe one that is not worded just right, or left to the imagination of a few. The discussion overall is healthy and it is good to know that there are many fans! While we can all take the good with the bad the industry as a whole is never perfect nor will it ever be. If I was managing public communications for a corporation I would not answer to this thread either, why you ask? Because I don't have to, simply I have bigger fish to fry, my focus is revenue generation not micro blogging and further I have a global network to serve and please do not responding is likely the most diplomatic approach.

Those of you that know me understand that I never BS and I have been engaged in customer meeting where I have delivered just the facts. Sometimes some education mostly just facts so that an End User or Partner can make the best educated decisions. The rest is easy

I realized this had a "click bait" title when I posted this originally. I took about a day to think on this before posting here. Had I titled this post "is Avigilon trying to sell to end users directly" there would have been very little conversation around the subject. This discussion has been extremely helpful and I wouldn't have gotten the responses any other way. There's a reason buzzfeed is so popular (although I did unfollow them). Up until now we have had a firm policy not to do business with manufacturers or Rep firms who regularly involve themselves with end users. While we've never been burned ourselves we have see good integrators get burned by both manufacturers and Rep firms. In the last 3 decades we have had a manufacturer onsite with us one time for a sales presentation. We're not a small company and are very competent in what we do.

After reading the above comments I am more open to the idea of having manufacturers more involved in the sales process. I'm still a little concerned with manufacturers cutting out integrators and going direct. If I owned Avigilon that is what I would do.

I am of the opinion Avigilon is about to do something big, I have good reason to believe this and it has nothing to do with this email. I personally think this move will be to go direct, either though subcontracting electricians or buying integrators, the way the email is written helps me come to this conclusion among other things. Yes they didn't say they wanted to sell to me as an end user. However it seems that they're trying to build relationships with end users beyond a standard marketing campaign.

What I've really learned from this conversation is that Avigilon dealers are willing to defend their beloved product line just as blindly as many hikvision dealers. This isn't always a bad thing.

This back and forth has lasted so long I have to chime in again.  As an owner of an integration business you want to work with manufacturers that have a dealer direct model if you can, especially if you are good at your business.  Avigilon is that company period.  I have never had to worry about them coming in to my customers and trying to go direct. After 7 years of selling their product, growing our business and their brand in our market, I have never once worried about what is being discussed. We have sold $5,900,000 in the last three years with them so if you have questions about them at all please reach out to me I can clear the air for you. Their product simply makes us a better company.

Everyone needs to focus a little more clearly on the distinction of "selling" direct and actually having a manufacturer doing business directly with an end user. I have no proof that Avigilon has bypassed integrators but I do have many examples of them quoting/budgeting end users (this is a fact), meeting with end users without any systems integrators chosen/selected or even aware that said meetings were taking place (this is a fact).  Mr. Mason clearly is having a different experience than others, this is good, for him.  Now, we want manufacturers to stimulate sales, this is a good thing which we all can probably agree BUT I don't want to lead or represent a manufacture that talks about budget's/quotes/costs and set expectations with my potential/future customer before I am even in the picture (fact).  Lastly, when the above has happened, Avigilon has brought in multiple "dealers" and as I said before, all this does is bring down margin, a waste of time.  To be clear, I have made no comment about their product, just on how they go to market.  I have walked into opportunities and found out they had Avigilon already and learned that it was installed by an electrical contractor, or by an HVAC company (fact!).  

NOTICE: This comment has been moved to its own discussion: Should Manufacturers, Like Avigilon, Talk About Budgets/Quotes/Cost And Set Expectations With End Users Before An Integrator Is Involved?

I think I've seen this scenario hinted at, but try this hypothetical on for size:

You have a current large client wanting to explore alternate options to the systems you're currently providing them - due diligence, and all. You approach Avigilon, enter a partnership, then piece together some pricing for your client. It turns out to be nearly twice the price of your current offerings, and because of that and a couple other reasons, the client decides against it. Since you have no other clients interested in that level of systems, the partnership ends.

Some time later, you find out Avigilon is directly courting your client. As noted here, it's a common practice, and not necessarily "selling direct". However, if your client does go for it, that means Avigilon calls in another integrator, and still effectively steals your client, passing them on to a different partner.

Still feels a little shady.

Avigilon's corporate response:

Our go to market strategy is to sell through our network of valued system integrators. We focus on creating awareness for our products and helping make our system integrator partners successful.

We asked Avigilon to clarify if they 'only' sell through system integrators, which Avigilon replied:

We’ll stick with our statement. Some great discussion on the posts about this from some supportive integrators.

We also published this separately since this discussion has gotten so long. Here - Avigilon Responds to Direct Sales Discussion