What 51 Members Want Us To Test

DWG • IPVMU Certified

Awesome. Great resource.

Reactions:

Scott Sheldrake

Would love to see the PoE switch tests. Is there really difference between a $50 PoE switch and a $500 one?

Reactions:

(7)

Jon Dillabaugh

In reply to Scott Sheldrake

Pro Focus LLC

I would never trust a $50 PoE switch? LOL

Reactions:

(2)

(1)

Ethan Ace

In reply to Jon Dillabaugh

That's fine, but lots of integrators do trust them for small installs. I know of at least one person who swears TrendNet PoE switches have worked without issue for them for several years.

Are they suited for enterprise installs? No. Can you run a four camera mom and pop shop on one? Quite possibly yes.

Reactions:

(2)

Jon Dillabaugh

Pro Focus LLC

In reply to Ethan Ace

I can see where some integrators *cough slammers* might be fine using a $50 PoE switch, but I'm not. There is no way a $50 PoE switch is going to be a fully managed switch, supporting individual port power cycling via software. We have used that feature of a PoE switch more times than I can remember when troubleshooting remotely. In the cases where we used an unmanaged switch, we regretted it. I don't care if the customer doesn't understand the difference, I can. It allows me to do my job more efficiently.

And, a 4 cam mom and pop is getting analog from me, not IP.

Reactions:

(1)

Scott Sheldrake

In reply to Jon Dillabaugh

Hey Jon, just curious what type of PoE switch you use? I've been trying to find one with the ability to remote power cycle individual ports.

Reactions:

Jon Dillabaugh

In reply to Scott Sheldrake

Pro Focus LLC

Ubiquiti ToughSwitch Pro or EdgeSwitch

Reactions:

(1)

Carla Calk

I would like to see this: Salient Systems VMS

Reactions:

(1)

Carl Lindgren

An IndigoVision Ultra 2k camera, please. Let's see if it meets the advertised claims that IPVM criticized.

Reactions:

(2)

(7)

(1)

Carl Lindgren

LOL. To whoever keeps marking my posts "Unhelpful": if you think that will have any effect on my posting frequency or content, you are sadly mistaken. In fact, it will just make me more resigned to post when and where I normally wouldn't...

Reactions:

(2)

(8)

(5)

Carl Lindgren

Double LOL. And you call me a jerk?

Reactions:

(8)

(3)

John Honovich

IPVM

There's just not enough interest in IndigoVision and we were not criticizing the camera, simply IndigoVision's marketing.

Reactions:

(1)

(2)

Carl Lindgren

In reply to John Honovich

Seriously? I guess there must have been a huge amount of interest in ioimage? Scallop? Speco? March?

Reactions:

(1)

(2)

John Honovich

IPVM

Speco claims industry best low light performance, which we debunked. And people have asked us about it for years.

Scallop is one of just a few multi-imager cameras and many people have asked for alternatives to Arecont.

ioimage is one of the few high end analytics on the market and, especially after the VideoIQ acquisition, a number of people asked for it.

March was requested by a very large end user, who did it politely.

IndigoVision 2K is a very late to market 1080p dome, and there's just not much interest in such products nor is there much in IndigoVision specifically.

Reactions:

(1)

Carl Lindgren

In reply to John Honovich

"Please" isn't polite enough? More than 1,000 cameras isn't large enough?

Reactions:

(1)

John Honovich

IPVM

No, a single 1,000 camera end user is not large / significant enough to justify doing a test.

Reactions:

(1)

Undisclosed #1

Won't Indigo simply give you one of these cameras to test yourself? I would think if you put in so much of their stuff they could give, or loan, you a camera for testing.

Reactions:

(1)

Carl Lindgren

Undisclosed,

They have but we have nothing to compare it to, no eye charts or young man to hold them, no variable lighting, etc..

Also, we can't keep installing/uninstalling cameras on the casino floor for testing purposes; especially multiple cameras for side-by-side shootouts.

Reactions:

(1)

Undisclosed #1

So you're going to buy cameras for your casino based solely on the results of an IPVM test?

How did you select your current cameras for their applications?

Reactions:

(1)

(2)

(4)

Undisclosed Distributor #2

They asked the question on Yahoo Answers.

Reactions:

(1)

(5)

Carl Lindgren

I'll answer your question with a question: would you buy a vehicle based solely on Car and Driver's recommendation? Edmunds? Motor Trend? Consumer Reports? Neither would I.

What I would do is use IPVM's testing as one factor among many. IPVM can't/won't test for every factor we use in determining which camera(s) best fit our rather far-ranging criteria but their tests do give me hints about what cameras are worth a second look. Then I would obtain an evaluation unit for testing in our casino.

Those tests cover factors that IPVM would not test typically for: ability to provide good image quality in low light, high light, back lit, high reflections and high contrast situations. I would also test the camera's ability to integrate with our VMS; its ability to provide multiple streams at 30fps; its ability to provide simultaneous TCP/IP Unicast and Multicast ONVIF streams; its ease of mounting in various locations; its weight; lens choices; aiming flexibility (pan/tilt/rotate) and other factors.

Then, I would compare its flaws and virtues to other cameras we have tested before deciding what camera(s) to buy.

I am known as a demanding client. I don't think I would even consider products from manufacturers and/or distributors who respond to my questions in a condescending manner.

Reactions:

(2)

(1)

Carl Lindgren

One final factor: price. I want cameras that offer "the most bang for the buck".

Reactions:

(1)

Undisclosed #1

In all honesty, I consider most of the camera tests IPVM does as targeted toward a mainstream use case. And while they are fairly thorough, they're not exhaustive. Basically, good to sort of say "If you're familiar with Camera X, here is how Camera Y might relate to it."

For you, and your application, I wouldn't expect the IPVM tests to have much value at all, unless they said the camera was just an outright failure or something. I would expect you to do your own tests, using criteria that YOU can define and duplicate and control.

My question was not condescending. But if you use the auto analogy, it's like trying to select a car for a cross-country road race that ends with a demolition derby. The mainstream magazines that test and rate cars are just not going to be that helpful, your use case is very different.

Reactions:

(1)

Carl Lindgren

Granted, IPVM is not the be-all end-all to camera testing but as really the only game in CCTV town, they are a resource.

My analogy to Consumer Reports, is a valid example. I wouldn't buy a car based solely on what they say but I would use their ratings as a guide. For instance, if I was in the market for a mid-size sedan, I would consider one of their top picks (Subaru Legacy, Honda Accord, Toyota Camry) over one in their bottom picks (Chrysler 200, Kia Optima, Nissan Altima).

In the same vein, if IPVM said a product performed poorly, I would be far less likely to even ask the manufacturer or a distributor for an evaluation unit.

Do I wish IPVM or at least someone published tests that more closely aligned with our criteria? Of course! But since that is unlikely, I'll take what I can get.

And there are so many camera brands (yes, I know many are rebrandings) that it is vurtually impossible for us to test more than a small fraction of them. So how to weed the huge number down to a manageable level? Hopefully, diligent research and possibly the assistance of resources like IPVM.

Reactions:

(3)

(1)

Scott Sheldrake

I'd like to see an actual long term test performed on PoE switches to see if expensive ones perform better or if cheap ones have a higher failure rate. I'm convinced they are all made in the same factory and companies just OEM them and charge what they can get away with for their particular brand.

Reactions:

(1)

Jon Dillabaugh

In reply to Scott Sheldrake

Pro Focus LLC

Yes and Axis cameras are probably made by Cantonk too...

Reactions:

(2)

(1)

Pam Brum

To quickly address one of the notes above regarding IP PTZs for City Surveillance, Pelco’s line of HD PTZ cameras (Spectra HD, Esprit HD and Spectra Professional) can accurately mask scenes using the window blanking function effect.

Additionally, with the latest firmware release in early December 2014, Spectra HD now has 6 window blanking modes:

Gray blank
Smear Monochrome
Smear Color
Pixelate Monochrome (mosaic-like)
Pixelate Color (mosaic-like)
Posterize

Reactions:

(1)

(4)

Rob Herrington

IPVMU Certified

This may be too specialized, but I would like to see a comparison on the integration of VMS's into Access Control systems. I am seeing more and more where camera manufacturers are limiting access to API's because they are pushing their own management product; and this is compounded when those same manufacturers start coming out with access control suites.

Reactions:

(1)

Undisclosed #3

IPVMU Certified

Low cost NVR shootout: Hikvision vs. Dahua

Reactions:

John Honovich

In reply to Undisclosed #3

IPVM

We've covered this in the Hikvision HDTVI VS Dahua HDCVI report. There's not a lot more to say about them as they are similarly basic.

Now, Hikvision says that they are coming out with Hikvision IVMS 5200 - A Competitor To Genetec And Milestone? but I am not sure if that is available outside of China yet. When that is, we'll test it.

Reactions:

(1)

Undisclosed #3